Yes, Using That Other OS Can Hurt Your Business

Yes. For years my business was education, K-12. I switched to GNU/Linux because that other OS would not work for me and my students: refusing to boot, re-re-rebooting, picking up malware, slowing down, freezing, etc.“A few days ago in the second tier Paderborn played Chemnitz. This was the second last matchday and both teams needed a win to not get relegated. Match was supposed to start at 7.30PM … but the laptop that controls/displays the time, score and the 24 second clock needed an Windows Update right when the game was supposed to start (it worked during the warmup).
See Something weird happened in the second tier of the german basketball league. : nba.”
This is an example of That Other OS harming a business, basketball. A game was delayed because the computer used to run the scoreboard insisted on updating that other OS instead of getting on with business. Something that would take mere seconds with GNU/Linux took minutes, delaying the game. According to the rules, the home-team was penalized for delaying the game, costing them a valuable competitive spot.

If you don’t want to risk damaging your business by running That Other OS, I recommend Debian GNU/Linux. The world can and does make its own software and shares it with the world. You can use it too. It will work for you and not against you. Even better, you can run, examine, modify and distribute the software under the licence you get with the software. There’s no EULA from Hell restricting what you can do with your computers and you can get the best performance of your hardware.

Don’t be a loser. Become a GNU/Linux user.

See also Basketball-Zweitligist Paderborn: Windows-Update schuld am Zwangsabstieg (German) / Basketball Zweitligist Paderborn: Windows Update to blame for the demotion (Google Translate)

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
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43 Responses to Yes, Using That Other OS Can Hurt Your Business

  1. oiaohm wrote, “running the most current Linux distribution on something X years old that use to support Linux”.

    Yes, that’s true for anything pre-AMD64. Many modern distros dropped 386 and the Linux kernel dropped some old drivers. Of course, because source code exists, an old driver could be ported for a particular purpose. This is a huge plus for GNU/Linux because some folks have one off or very expensive hardware that cannot easily/simply be replaced. Still, very few PCs have ISA buses these days. You’d probably have to bootstrap it by networking an old distro and a new one, like a real “virtual machine”, but there’s always a way. I played with a 15 year old machine at my last school. It took hours just to figure out how to install the old distro because the hardware was not completely working but eventually it acted as a thin client and the latest Debian GNU/Linux running on my terminal server was accessible from that piece of junk and the hardware of that old PC was accessible from the terminal server. It was slow… 10mbits/s NIC and all… but it did work. It was the last machine chosen by students but it gave us one more seat.

  2. oiaohm says:

    Robert Pogson the limit I was referring to as running the most current Linux distribution on something X years old that use to support Linux. Security reasons you would not run something like Redhat 1.0.

  3. oiaohm wrote, “Linux does have a support Limit. 10-15 years.”

    RedHat has an archive going back to ancient times, like RedHat 1.0, from 1995. Debian goes back to 1996.

    I’d hate to use those anywhere but a museum but they should work if you have a complete set of old hardware just as they did back in the day. Problems might exist where you have a mix of old and new hardware and security would be a joke.

  4. oiaohm says:

    kurkosdr something to remember why hybrid graphics is such a problem on Linux is that Hybrid graphics is Intel and Nvidia and you need their developers on the same page.

    Linux Intel driver makers are extremely open source in nature. Nvidia X86 developers is extremely closed source in nature. How can you say cat fight from hell. Interesting enough Nvidia arm developers have had working intel nvidia hybrid for last 6 years for arm hardware. Please note Nvidia arm GPU are also fully open source drivers so no cat fight.

    Really lot of Linux people would love to lock the x86 Nvidia and Intel graphic driver development teams in a single hall and will only let them out once they have agreed to get along and have coded working Hybrid driver.

  5. oiaohm says:

    http://www.zdnet.com/article/dell-offers-new-ubuntu-linux-workstation-laptop/

    Deaf Spy Dell does have google adds out XPS Linux laptops. So yes its the way you are tagged if you will see Linux devices or not.

    Deaf Spy Direct X out box provides a lot of software emulation. I know this from debug game rollcage with wine and having major trouble with the lead developer. Yes the virtual machine he was using and it was running in software mode.

    kurkosdr Linux is picky on newer hardware not as picky as OS X.
    “decent GPU video encode”
    https://developer.nvidia.com/nvidia-video-codec-sdk
    Ok that is the nvidia one. Please note the interesting point
    “346.22 or above for Linux.” Funny old version of the Linux Nvidia driver works where windows it only works with 347.09. Something really interesting is the first 3 numbers is a core number. So a Linux or Freebsd or Windows driver with the same first 3 numbers has identical binary blob inside to drive the hardware. So its not only open source drivers giving more support to older hardware. Closed source Nvidia drivers also give better support to older hardware in case of buggy hardware being driver picky. Why Linux gets any new Nvidia acceleration feature in closed source driver before the Windows driver. When it comes to running closed source Nvidia other than hybrid Windows is second string to Linux.

    Encoding with intel hardware same as with Windows. Only hardware with a encoding problem is AMD graphics.

    kurkosdr the annoying reality here is your GPU arguement is part upside down. Nvidia standalone not hybrid Linux is first with all new features Windows is always second. Intel Windows is slightly ahead in some areas. AMD graphics hardware disaster zone for Linux but is getting better.

    You have to remember Linux is used in movie render farms. Yes those beasts do run X11 and X11 graphics drivers. Laptop hybrid graphics is not well supported but your stand alone graphic card is very well support as this is required to sell a few 1000 cards in one volume order.

    Deaf Spy
    Linux, “resurrecting” old hardware, is definitely counter to point 1.
    Not exactly Linux does have a support Limit. 10-15 years.

    Selling support for it would increase dramatically the risk to have to deal with hardware failure and replace parts.
    You really do need to look at how Dell and HP does this. Not avoid replacement parts its called replacement clause in contract where the complete computer gets replaced with newer model. Customer pays so much per year and if machine breaks it is replaced.

    Yes how Dell and HP gets around it is lease you the hardware. This is how they sell long term support on hardware. Yes its fully support but you have also agree to purchase replacements at Dell/HP going price if the machines are older than X years old. Selling support Dell/HP way is quite profitable since each failure of a old machine is sale that will not have to go through a competitive bid process. Yes Windows having to be replaced frequent reduces the amount of money HP/Dell can make avoiding the bidding process.

  6. Deaf Spy says:

    then OEMs have no interest in selling the damn thing, besides some token effort

    What I mean is that OEMs need a constant inflow of money to sustain and develop their business. It may come in two ways:
    1. Selling new units.
    2. Selling support.

    Linux, “resurrecting” old hardware, is definitely counter to point 1. Now, selling support has three serious implications here. First, old hardware usually means it is beyond the common warranty period. Selling support for it would increase dramatically the risk to have to deal with hardware failure and replace parts. Second, people who are not willing to invest into new hardware (we speak of only a few hundred bucks here, not of thousands), are not likely to be willing to spend extra money for support. Third, Linux has already proven to be notoriously difficult to support due to the high fragmentation or “choice”, as you love to call it.

  7. Deaf Spy says:

    Deaf Spy must have issues if he can’t see that OEMs are shipping GNU/Linux and advertising the fact. They make more money selling GNU/Linux because the licence costs them less… Do the maths.
    Pogson, this is embarrassing. Windows with Bing costs zero. 0. How come 0 > 0?

    Btw, I still fail to see any ad for a PC with Linux. I see only ads for PCs with Android and Windows with Bing. Perhaps this is just me, the way Googles targets me.

  8. dougman says:

    KUKU, this may come as a surprise to you, but needing the latest graphics drivers is not a necessary need for me.

    The current machine I am using to send this message is Dell Inspiron 3847 with an i5 CPU and Xeon E3-1200 integrated GPU.

    Everything just works with Linux and boots in under 10-seconds!

  9. kurkosdr says:

    I think what DeafSpy meant was that if Linux’s best feature is ressurecting old hardware (such as allowing older GPUs to have somewhat newer OpenGL) while at the same time failing to support newer hardware decently (for example newest OpenGL in new hardware, hybrid graphics, decent GPU video encode) because for example X.org is a pile of bovine excrement and take a lot of effort to produce a proper driver for it, then OEMs have no interest in selling the damn thing, besides some token effort.

  10. dougman says:

    Re: Which begs the question: If teachers were better paid, would we get better teachers?

    Good question, lets expound upon that shall we?

    If Microsoft was paid more money, would we get better software?

    LOL…. I am sure we all KNOW the answer.

  11. luvr says:

    It is a definite shortcoming market-wise, because it provides no way for hardware OEMs to make money.

    And I’m obliged to put the interests of OEMs above my own why again?

  12. kurkosdr says:

    Here is Pog again, cropping the bottom and top out of tables to the point where less than 1/100th of the table is visible anymore, in an attempt to make statistical noise seem like something big.

    But hey, Pog just wants to highlight his point, right? The fact that this practice is acceptable only when the competing qualities are of comparable size (not ~1 vs >80) does not seem to bother our ex-teacher friend.

    Which begs the question: If teachers were better paid, would we get better teachers?

  13. antifanboy wrote, “EVERY YEAR, wishful thinking Linux Nazis like yourself are proven WRONG. This year is no different. Get over it.”

    It’s true that somewhere to someone, it’s the Year of GNU/Linux on the Desktop, but 2015 is different. The webstats which languished for five years or more at ~1% have shot up. The global average, yesterday, was 1.72%. In 2010, for the same date, and a weekday, it was 0.81%. That’s StatCounter’s Global average number, not the top-end. The top ten countries also doubled their numbers. Further, the rate of increase is increasing.


    See that. GNU/Linux is taking off. Open your eyes and quit repeating lies.

  14. Deaf Spy wrote, “quasi-religious conviction and using fud and utter lies.”

    What? You mean the fanbois of That Other OS are getting on your nerves?

  15. Deaf Spy, shouting into a barrel, wrote, “Check out new tablets, and small-factor PCs. You will see Android and 8.1 with Bing. No Linux. No Debian, no Ubuntu, no Slack, no Mint, no nothing. On small-factor PCs, even Android is not there anymore.”

    hmmm….
    “linux desktop pc” finds 14413 products on Alibaba.com. “linux notebook pc” finds 10,093 hits.

    Deaf Spy must have issues if he can’t see that OEMs are shipping GNU/Linux and advertising the fact. They make more money selling GNU/Linux because the licence costs them less… Do the maths.

    Here’s an example, one with Android 4 and Linux 3.4, $50-$100 each in 500-quantity. Just ask. China will supply whatever you want.

  16. dougman says:

    The majority of Windows software in China is pirated, I would not run around gloating that, as by OldFart’s definition, China would be full of cheapskates.

    That’s a $63.4 billion in revenue lost! But now they declare that it is ok, we are willing to lose money to win it.

    http://www.businessinsider.com/r-microsoft-tackles-china-piracy-with-free-upgrade-to-windows-10-2015-3

  17. Deaf Spy says:

    And for what it’s worth, that’s a fenomenal quality, not a shortcoming
    It is a definite shortcoming market-wise, because it provides no way for hardware OEMs to make money. Game over for Linux here.

    Btw, go to a Chinese market – dx.com, banggood, alibaba, whatever. Check out new tablets, and small-factor PCs. You will see Android and 8.1 with Bing. No Linux. No Debian, no Ubuntu, no Slack, no Mint, no nothing. On small-factor PCs, even Android is not there anymore.

  18. Deaf Spy says:

    You mean like those guys using XP still?
    Everyone has a choice and is responsible for it. I have no problem with people choosing XP, Linux, Mac, 7, 8, 8.1, BSD, whatever. I have problem with people who cannot accept that and what to enforce their personal choice onto other people. Especially when this is done in the name of some quasi-religious conviction and using fud and utter lies.

  19. Deaf Spy says:

    Deaf Spy even under Windows not all features of Opengl 4.x is implemented in closed source drivers.
    That is true, but only because OpenGl is a clusterfuck beyond repair. Still, Windows manages to support OpenGl head and shoulder better than Linux.

    No point using the word Fifi You can find game developers complaining about the differences between opengl dirvers. Yes under Windows game developers use opengl wrappers to cover up issues hopefully.
    Until you keep writing utter non-sense, I will. And keep proving that gaming development is yet another topic you have no clue about whatsoever, thank you.

    Direct X depends a lot on software emulation to cover up hardware issues.
    No, it doesn’t. Drivers do that.

  20. luvr says:

    LinuxIsGreatForRessurectingOldHardware(tm)

    You bet! And for what it’s worth, that’s a fenomenal quality, not a shortcoming!

  21. kurkosdr says:

    Older hardware under Linux will have high Opengl versions than same old hardware under Windows

    LinuxIsGreatForRessurectingOldHardware(tm)

  22. Deaf Spy wrote, “98% of world’s population will not, and do not.”

    You mean like those guys using XP still?

  23. oiaohm says:

    kurkosdr
    This is what you FOSSies don’t get. Microsoft doesn’t want you to use default drivers for everything else than setting up your system. Because third parties are responsible for drivers. Because they also make the hardware. Because you shouldn’t have to play the game of “hey guys!!11! what driver are you guys using???” but instead use a driver providing by the hardware manufacturer.

    This is where you run into major trouble. 1 I am not a FOSS person.

    The default drivers being better on Linux has some major advantages of setting a high base level that hardware makers have to exceed when making closed source drivers.

    kurkosdr when you get a map of opengl version support across hardware you find something horible. Older hardware under Linux will have high Opengl versions than same old hardware under Windows. So Linux gets longer term of application support as long as you deal with runtime issues.

    kurkosdr basically stop making claims without doing the matrixs of support.

  24. kurkosdr says:

    for everything else = for anything else

  25. kurkosdr says:

    Windows on default drivers

    Oh gawd, oh gawd…

    This is what you FOSSies don’t get. Microsoft doesn’t want you to use default drivers for everything else than setting up your system. Because third parties are responsible for drivers. Because they also make the hardware. Because you shouldn’t have to play the game of “hey guys!!11! what driver are you guys using???” but instead use a driver providing by the hardware manufacturer.

    Compare and contrast with Desktop Linux, and it’s stupid “we should control all dem drivers” mentality. And then whining at companies for not abiding to that silly desire.

  26. oiaohm says:

    Deaf Spy even under Windows not all features of Opengl 4.x is implemented in closed source drivers.

    Even worse for Linux, Fifi. Even worse. Of course, you’re so proud of using an inferior system.
    No point using the word Fifi You can find game developers complaining about the differences between opengl dirvers. Yes under Windows game developers use opengl wrappers to cover up issues hopefully.

    Of course, you’re so proud of using an inferior system.
    Its not that I am proud about using inferior system. I am realistic.

    Direct X depends a lot on software emulation to cover up hardware issues.

    Nvidia closed source on Windows, OS X, Linux and Freebsd support level of opengl is identical. Windows on default drivers has worse Opengl/Direct X support than Linux Distributions on default.

  27. Deaf Spy says:

    Note proprietary drivers don’t support all Opengl 4.x features either.
    Even worse for Linux, Fifi. Even worse. Of course, you’re so proud of using an inferior system.

  28. Deaf Spy says:

    I’ll take an older version of OpenGL over having to use a slow, inflexible, and properitary OS.
    You will. 98% of world’s population will not, and do not. Good thing we all have choice.

  29. oiaohm says:

    http://mesamatrix.net/

    So, to conclude, no driver that is open-source and has support for the latest OpenGL 3.3.

    Really its so simple to find out what Opengl under Mesa is upto. kurkosdr

    Note proprietary drivers don’t support all Opengl 4.x features either. Mesa is every official feature up to Opengl 3.3 and selected features across the complete Opengl 4.x range. Yes at the rate things are going Opengl 4.5 feature will be ticked off before the rest of Opengl 4.x are complete.

  30. dougman says:

    KUKU, runs all new latest drivers, but whines when his Win-Doh’s is broken.

    Meanwhile, Linux keeps chugging along with very long uptimes and does not have the insecurity footprint that Win-dohs has, nor needs the vast capital expense or human manpower to keep the POS of functional in the long-term.

  31. LinuxGentlesir says:

    I’ll take an older version of OpenGL over having to use a slow, inflexible, and properitary OS. It’s a trade off surely. Windows blows.

  32. kurkosdr says:

    Correction: So, to conclude, no driver that is open-source and has support for the latest OpenGL. Only OpenGL 3.3.

  33. kurkosdr says:

    Meanwhile with Windows, backward compatibility works with proprietary drivers, no need to care about your driver being open or not. No need to compromise with reverse-engineered nonsense.

  34. kurkosdr says:

    So, to conclude, no driver that is open-source and has support for the latest OpenGL 3.3.

    Only proprietary drivers that break.

  35. kurkosdr says:

    OpenGL Compliance (Driver/Hardware) – 3.3/4.x

    Lol, OpenGL 3.3.

  36. dougman says:

    Hmmm..

    ~ $ glxinfo | grep “OpenGL version”
    OpenGL version string: 3.0 Mesa 10.3.0

    http://www.mesa3d.org/relnotes/10.3.html

    A bit dated, but not too bad. Should update my Intel drivers in a few days.

  37. dougman says:

    KUKU avoiding the topic as usual. Bad GPU drivers? Pulseaudio mess? Never seen those problems, perhaps you don’t know what you are doing. People like you deserve Windows…LOL.

    What does OpenGL have to do with Win-Dohs injuring ones business? We are bashing M$, and you come in trying to change the subject.

    Back on subject……… http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/03/19/cansecwest_talk_bioses_hack/

    Windows IS the vector, by which the BIOS becomes infected.

  38. kurkosdr wrote, “Find me a GNU/Linux driver which a) has full hardware-accelerated support for the latest OpenGL and b) is open-source.”

    radeonsi “OpenGL Compliance (Driver/Hardware) – 3.3/4.x”

  39. kurkosdr says:

    don’t have root for = don’t have source for.

  40. kurkosdr says:

    The EULA permits M$ to do what it wants with your software systems

    And Shuttleworth has root. So do the Debian devs.

    Hey! I don’t have any problem with those. I don’t use PA at all and Debian takes care of all those dependency “problems”. They have the source code. Problem solved.

    Enough monkey-talk. Find me a GNU/Linux driver which a) has full hardware-accelerated support for the latest OpenGL and b) is open-source. Don’t try to evade the question, type the name of the driver.

    There is no such thing. It’s either not having good graphics or having breakages because of the use of packages that Debian don’t have root for.

  41. kurkosdr wrote, “with Windows you can put updates to notify only and get on with business.”

    No. That doesn’t work. The EULA permits M$ to do what it wants with your software systems. I personally have lost a weekend or more to fixing systems M$ broke with updates disabled. In one case, M$ forced XP SP2 on us in the middle of the night with updates disabled and in another case XP insisted on an update in the middle of my lecture.

    kurkosdr also wrote of GNU/Linux, “bad GPU drivers, the PulseAudio mess, the app compat breakages”

    Hey! I don’t have any problem with those. I don’t use PA at all and Debian takes care of all those dependency “problems”. They have the source code. Problem solved.

  42. kurkosdr says:

    Don’t be a loser. Become a GNU/Linux user.

    GNU/Linux has it’s own problems, like bad GPU drivers, the PulseAudio mess, the app compat breakages. See my previous post in the fonts blogpost.

    At least with Windows you can put updates to notify only and get on with business.

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