Hugo Chavez Wins With Reduced Majority in Venezuela

“Mr Chavez won 54% of the vote, the electoral council announced, with turnout at about 81%.”

via BBC News – Hugo Chavez celebrates re-election in Venezuela.

Venezuela is one of the South American countries with a pro-FLOSS government policy. In the last five years use of GNU/Linux has doubled, according to NetApplications (Web stats). The longer Chavez remains in power the greater the hold GNU/Linux will have in government and the longer GNU/Linux will be displayed to students.

Chavez’ chief competitor also supports education and approves of some of the reforms done in Brazil. That should mean that two large and powerful political organizations both embrace FLOSS and GNU/Linux in Venzuela.

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
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35 Responses to Hugo Chavez Wins With Reduced Majority in Venezuela

  1. oldman says:

    That takes care of 99% of support for most individuals and organizations, far less than letting M$ update their OS and a few apps, then Adobe, then Oracle, then… let alone worrying about zero-day exploits on Patch Tuesday From Hell and the usual malware.

    OMG

    I cannot even begin to answer such ignorent drivel.
    I should not be surprised that you really believe that this is all there is to system maintenance. Your ignorance of real IT policies and procedures knows no bounds Robert Pogson.

    Running Crapt-get does not and never has constituted support, no matter what you think.

    The question that should be asked is “Why should I support M$?” I don’t think anyone has a good reason to do that with the current state of FLOSS. That many large and diverse organizations have switched is proof.

    You may as well as “why should I pay for groceries?”
    such a question is for most people just as relevant to choosing software. What you want is irrelevant as you have established time and time again that you will and have ignored completely any issues beyond those directly relevant to your own agenda.

  2. oldman wrote, again, “The software must also be fit for purpose – it only takes one missing major feature to knock an application out of the running be it open or closed.”

    Irrelevant. None of M$’s bloat is a major feature. They even messed up text-justification by making “left” the default long after the typewriter had faded.

    oldman wrote, again, “THen there are the support costs for same.

    But even if a desktop FOSS package passes muster, almost all of the desktop FOSS that arent dreck are available for windows and/or OS X. One does not even need to change ones environment to run FOSS”

    cd mylist_of_PCs;for f in *;do ssh $f “apt-get update;apt-get upgrade”;done

    That takes care of 99% of support for most individuals and organizations, far less than letting M$ update their OS and a few apps, then Adobe, then Oracle, then… let alone worrying about zero-day exploits on Patch Tuesday From Hell and the usual malware.

    Of course one can run some FLOSS on that other OS but it’s better on GNU/Linux: lower cost, less malware, easier maintenance, FREEdom to make copies or interconnect PCs on a network, no EULA, etc.

    The question that should be asked is “Why should I support M$?” I don’t think anyone has a good reason to do that with the current state of FLOSS. That many large and diverse organizations have switched is proof.

  3. oldman says:

    gimpo – Gimp

  4. oldman says:

    Everyone can appreciate that the licence comes with the code and that’s usually a free download or comes on the PC.

    Yes but cost is not the sole determinant of choice Pog. The software must also be fit for purpose – it only takes one missing major feature to knock an application out of the running be it open or closed.

    THen there are the support costs for same.

    But even if a desktop FOSS package passes muster, almost all of the desktop FOSS that arent dreck are available for windows and/or OS X. One does not even need to change ones environment to run FOSS

    And I believe that if you actually cared to look you would find that the majority of desktop OSS isnt even run on linux, as the developers of gimpo recently acknowledged in embarassment.

  5. Chris Weig wrote, “All the other freedoms — freedom to look at the source code, to modify it etc. — aren’t of great importance to the average user.”

    Yes, people like “free as in beer” but above all they like that they can install or run the code. Everyone I know loves that. Everyone can appreciate that the licence comes with the code and that’s usually a free download or comes on the PC.

  6. oiaohm says:

    Chris Weig
    –how can FLOSS make people more free if they don’t feel unfree without FLOSS?–

    First question are you sure they don’t? Not being able to share applications with friends and team mates can be a issue and interfere with productivity..

    FOSS does not just cover programs. Remember creative commons starts from the FOSS world.

    FOSS licensing around FOSS programs don’t just cover the source code. So you want to customise the manual for some reason you legally can with FOSS programs in most cases.

    Chris Weig focusing just on the source code misses the bigger picture of what a FOSS program gives under licenses that allow modification.

  7. Chris Weig says:

    That’s what’s called pretzel logic. Too many twists and turns. Good one Chris.

    Hoho. Kozmcrae has woken up from his sleep and spouts garbage. Here’s an easy explanation for you, so you may understand what I wrote:

    People who work — people who have to work to earn their living — are unfree. Do they feel that way? That depends on the circumstances, both individual and collective, but for most of them the answer will be: “No”. Society has seen to that. It has seen to that on an individual level, as you can always make changes to your situation of your own free will, and it has seen to that on a collective level, as with the advent of exchanging one’s labour for money concepts like free time came into existence, and free time — as opposed to work — is precisely a time in which one can do what he or she wants, as opposed to what work dictates.

    Hell, even the constitutional rights in Germany (or any other democracy) do not posit absolute freedom. And yet people do not feel unfree.

    So, once again, if you want to claim that FLOSS makes people more free then you first have to get these people to admit that their non-FLOSS software makes them unfree. In any case, the most important freedom FLOSS grants people is the “free as in beer” freedom. And you can doubt if this freedom is actually seen as a freedom, or rather as a special freedom, because free as in beer software existed already before FLOSS, and it certainly existed and exists in the closed source ecosystem, so it’s no novelty.

    All the other freedoms — freedom to look at the source code, to modify it etc. — aren’t of great importance to the average user.

    Therefore I ask again: how can FLOSS make people more free if they don’t feel unfree without FLOSS?

    The typical grave error in the Cult of FLOSS thinking.

  8. oiaohm says:

    lpbbear
    –So Windows Aero is so easy to copy the look of that any FOSS Window Manager can achieve it ehh?–

    Not any FOSS Windows Manager. ratpoison windows manager for sure cannot. Ratpoison is fully keyboard controlled. No windows boarders.

    Not all FOSS windows managers can be themed.

    http://xwinman.org/ So you get an idea of how many Windows managers there are.

    XFCE is not just Windows manager is a desktop environment.

    Gnome, KDE and XFCE can be themed to look like windows or OS X. Lxde looks at lot like windows out box order generations.

    lpbbear
    –Guess they’re not all that amazing in the design department at M$ft if the freebie folks can do it too.–

    Yep very correct Microsoft design department is fairly conservative except for metro. Most new things you see in Windows have been in a FOSS windows manager somewhere for many years before it appears in windows.

    If you want an extream windows manager lpbbear try Metisse. I hope someone ports this to wayland.

    Metisse is unique because you can theme you applications interfaces. Basically slice the applications interface up and reassemble it how it suites you. Even glue multi applications into 1 single window.

  9. lpbbear says:

    “So windows is ugly as hell by your standards good to know Chris Weig.”

    So Windows Aero is so easy to copy the look of that any FOSS Window Manager can achieve it ehh?

    Guess they’re not all that amazing in the design department at M$ft if the freebie folks can do it too.

    Just following your “logic”.

  10. oiaohm says:

    Chris Weig
    http://xfce-look.org/content/show.php/Win2-7%28Pixmap%29?content=118227
    That is not windows that XFCE with theme loaded.

    So windows is ugly as hell by your standards good to know Chris Weig.

  11. oiaohm says:

    Chris Weig read the Australian investigators report into Iraq. Between the two Iraq wars he operated. He found equipment for making building weapons of mass destruction all forms, bio, chemical and Nuclear. Most of it sourced from the USA paid for by the USA government. Hardware given so Iraq did not lose the Iran/Iraq war. Stupid cold war left overs. Yes Iraq did use in the Iran/Iraq war bio and chemical weapons.

    Sad but funny part. Sadaam stock pile of chemical weapons turned out to be containers filled with coloured water. All iraq documents read they were real. They had the real gear to make the stuff. The chemists working for Sadaam did not trust him not to use the stuff on the general population. For the chemists to protect their own hide they made up documents looking like the stuff had been moved before the inspectors got to them.

    So we have a case that Sadaam thinks he has chemical weapons the spies looking at Sadaam thinks he has chemical weapons yet the people on the ground who should be making the chemical weapons are not. Really who is going to check a drum marked chemical weapon. They only need to make a small amount so tests could be performed to prove to Sadaam he had chemical weapons. Same was true for Sadaam dry powder bio weapons. Australian investigator was picking up something was badly wrong. He knew one way or another someone in Iraq was hiding something it was either Sadaam or his weapon makers. You were not going to find out what one while Sadaam was in power.

    Who would dream the reality that he had already been disarmed by his own people.

    Chris Weig the Linux one you think is a joke. Linux allowed some of the gear to be internally sabotaged like chemical testing gear so a test sample of the coloured water would report to be chemical weapon due to the fact it was detecting the colour then on the print out doing the chemical weapon correct description even that the chemical weapons is not really in the sample. The Iraq wars could have gone a lot different if Sadaam had managed to have a real stock piles of chemical and bio weapons.

    Linux gives freedom to alter. This means you require the people working for you to be truly working for you.

    Its not only the weapon makers who sabotaged things. Those making the disposal systems also sabotaged things.

    Chris Weig Linux does not naturally support dictators. The freedom to alter can be a dictators worst nightmare.

    There is a old saying. Walk softly but carry a big stick. USA mil really don’t know this.

    Julian Assange is a computer hacker he was in the USA Mil net in the time of the first USA vs Iraq war. He documented a direct USA order to bomb a shelter that was off limits to be bombed right from who gave the order to who carried it out.

    USA government killing non combatants is not new. What was Julian Assange’s cost for breaching USA mil net fine of $2100 AUD and no jail time.

    Chris Weig have you not wondered why past a particular point in the first USA vs Iraq war that all ground and air operations over Iraq were transferred to being under control of an Australian General not a USA one. This happened because of Julian Assange and the documentation from the USA Mil net.

    In one way the USA mil is the biggest mass murder of civilians. The problem is its documented. So far from the war diaries and what Julian Assange got first Iraq war not a single USA person has been prosecuted.

    How can the USA government bring Iraq and other countries under the rule of law when the rule of law does not apply to their own soldiers or actions.

    There is a very big risk that the person who is in jail in the USA for giving wikileaks information is 100 percent not guilty. Scape goat so the USA Government does not have to admit the fact there systems were breached. Julian Assange has the skills to get into mil networks without assistance since he has used them in the past.

    The real stories are better than any conspiracy theory.

  12. dougman says:

    XFCE is a great GUI, even Linux uses it.

    Even Windows 7 GUI AERO shell was nice looking, but wait! M$ in its infinite wisdom METRO’d the whole mess so now you get NO GUI, just a tablet interface…jokes on you!

  13. kozmcrae says:

    Chris Weig attempts some kind of logic:

    “The freedom(s) granted by FLOSS can be incentives, but only for those who feel they’re limited by the absence of precisely those freedom(s) FLOSS would give them.”

    That’s what’s called pretzel logic. Too many twists and turns. Good one Chris.

  14. Chris Weig says:

    Chris Weig offers the tightest circular argument ever made

    You fail again, Pogson. This has nothing to do with circularity. I merely turned dougman’s ill-conceived argument on its head. The freedom(s) granted by FLOSS can be incentives, but only for those who feel they’re limited by the absence of precisely those freedom(s) FLOSS would give them.

  15. Chris Weig says:

    People just love a pretty GUI but that more than doubles the software needed to run a PC and multiplies the risk too.

    Last time I checked Linux came with GUIs, too. Granted, they’re not pretty, but still…

    Don’t you use XFCE? It’s ugly as hell, but it still multiplies the risk, Pogson. Embrace the text mode again.

  16. Chris Weig offers the tightest circular argument ever made, “You claim that FLOSS offers people more freedom, but you ignore that for this to be true people first have to feel unfree with what they have. And the truth is that few people actually do.”

    I think that should vanish into a black hole.

  17. Chris Weig wrote, “New intel suggests that Saddam was building weapons of mass destruction using Linux. Ballmer then made the call to begin the invasion.”

    Sadaam was crazy but he was crazy enough to fool lots of the leadership of the sheeple. What did that cost? Umpteen $billion, wanton destruction and hundreds of thousands dead… The result? Iraq is rapidly becoming an ally of Iran…

  18. Chris Weig says:

    And you think if some state-sponsored professionals wanted to set back Iran’s nuclear program they would’ve shuddered in horror had they encountered Linux? Keep deluding yourself, Doug, it’s amusing.

    Regarding your TechWorld propaganda piece: it was procedure not followed that caused the problem. The servers also did not crash, they were automatically shut down because procedure was not followed. See here:

    http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6004224/

    Or here:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/16/politics/16airports.html?_r=0

    It seems that TechWorld employs Cult of FLOSS members.

  19. People just love a pretty GUI but that more than doubles the software needed to run a PC and multiplies the risk too. Add to that the known malware and you are asking for trouble. Put it on a network or allow people to connect stuff…

  20. lpbbear says:

    “Just my guess – people were probably too busy running from exploding refineries to update the statistics.”

    Not sure what exploding refineries have to do with anything. You certainly not going to claim that is something unique to Venezuela and the Chavez government are you?

    (not even you could be THAT stoopid!)

    (nvm, I stand corrected, you certainly are that stoopid) ;P

  21. dougman says:

    The Iranian uranium enrichment centrifuges are built by Siemens and uses a Windows PLC system. The system was infected with Stuxnet and Flame malware.

    http://ansnuclearcafe.org/category/iran-uranium-enrichment/

    This is why you don’t use Windows.

    http://news.techworld.com/operating-systems/2275/microsoft-server-crash-nearly-causes-800-plane-pile-up/

  22. Chris Weig says:

    New intel suggests that Saddam was building weapons of mass destruction using Linux. Ballmer then made the call to begin the invasion.

    (I tried do imagine how a deranged FLOSS mind would work and have arrived at this conspiracy theory.)

  23. dougman says:

    Chris, your simply amazing! Correct..

    People are truly ignorant when it comes to computers, I see it everyday. It becomes rather nauseating, but hey it pays me well. 🙂

    Linux offers more for developers, more tools, more libraries, more performance, more freedom than M$ could ever hope to offer.

  24. Chris Weig says:

    Free software is grassroots, it’s just amazing how threatened mainstream people get when offered more freedom than they already have.

    Besides collective freedom(s) which are legally binding, like the rights established in a constitution, freedom is something indivdual. And that’s where the failure in your thinking comes from. You claim that FLOSS offers people more freedom, but you ignore that for this to be true people first have to feel unfree with what they have. And the truth is that few people actually do.

  25. dougman says:

    Free software is grassroots, it’s just amazing how threatened mainstream people get when offered more freedom than they already have. They slap you with all kinds of illogical boogeyman names.

  26. Chris Weig says:

    He has nationalized oil and gas reserves and as a result citizens in Venezuela enjoy the lowest gas prices on the planet.

    ROFL.

    You have probably ignored — Pogson, dougman and lpbbear are like the three monkeys: hear no evil, speak no evil, see no evil — that the cheap, state-subsidized gas and its extraction in Venezuela is quite troublesome for the country.

    Also, it can be said here again: on this blog Hitler would’ve been endorsed had he used Linux. Pogson, I’ll gladly notify you when Germany’s NPD — Nationaldemocratic Party Germany, the spiritual successor to the NSDAP — announces that they use Linux. Then you can praise them, too.

  27. That Exploit Guy says:

    @dougman

    ‘So what if Venezuela has low ratio use of automobiles, do bear in mind that the data you quoted is back from 2007, which is OLD news.’

    Just my guess – people were probably too busy running from exploding refineries to update the statistics. 😉

  28. Ivan says:

    Way to support your local dictator, Bob.

  29. dougman says:

    Hey Exploited, don’t you have some malware infested computer’s to manage?

    So what if Venezuela has low ratio use of automobiles, do bear in mind that the data you quoted is back from 2007, which is OLD news.

    Besides what lpbbear said is correct, Venezuela gas is at 9 cents a gallon vs. America at $3.5 so what was your point?

  30. That Exploit Guy says:

    @Ippbear

    ‘He has nationalized oil and gas reserves and as a result citizens in Venezuela enjoy the lowest gas prices on the planet.’

    Very relevant indeed:

    “Motor Vehicles (per 1,000 people)…

    “Venezula, RB… 147”

  31. dougman says:

    Off-topic, but reading the following link just goes to show you that open collaboration vs. closed is a far better, M$ should just give people what they want.

    http://www.itworld.com/data-centerservers/300901/how-replace-missing-start-button-windows-8

    New marketing pieces:

    “Windows, where users purchase additional software, to make the original software work”

    “Linux, it just works”

    “Android, 80% of market in 2015”

  32. lpbbear says:

    “* Sigh *”

    Sigh yourself. Pog is right. Chavez may not be a perfect in all things leader but the thing he has done fairly consistently is resist pressure from the US Government and US Corporations.

    He has nationalized oil and gas reserves and as a result citizens in Venezuela enjoy the lowest gas prices on the planet.

    In that light it would only make sense to use an operating system not beholden to some American corporation like M$ft.

    I’m sure this won’t last since Chavez is ailing and eventually some right wing dictator, who would be seen more favorably by the U.S. and its controlling corporations, will gain power there. Then you can rejoice at the return of M$FT and the usual right wing death squads that tend to accompany right wing South American governments.

    But no worries, at least then the M$ft brand will be there for those who haven’t already “disappeared”.

    *Sigh*

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