HAHAHA! Lose 8 Will Not Run Legacy Apps on ARM!

The port of that other OS to ARM will not be a port. “8” will not run legacy apps. So, advantage Android which already is running rampant over ARM with a ton of apps of all kinds including some legacy apps.

Speaking of ARM as a competitor on “8”,
“On ARM, there’ll be the new experience, which is very specifically around the mobile experience, specifically around tablet and some limited clamshell, with no legacy OS,” she said. “Our competitors will not be running legacy applications. Not now. Not ever.”

It’s Phoney “7” all over again, folks. Will this monstrosity, “8”, even have cut-and-paste? Will anyone be afraid of it? Without legacy apps? I don’t think so…

Chuckle. I love it when a good plan comes together. Android/Linux will, apparently, in the absence of anything but Apple, rule the world of ARM. Intel’s confidence lies in its belief that the ability to run x86 legacy apps on x86 is going to make x86 perpetual. They continue to ignore the obvious fact that ARM processors use 1/4 the battery power of x86. That is not going away any time soon. Legacy anything on x86 will suck bigtime. New apps designed for ARM and Android/Linux will fly like butterflies. Eventually x86 will reach some acceptable level of power consumption but that is years away. Android/Linux is booming, creating a legacy of apps against which Wintel has no competitive answer. Wintel is due for huge shrinkage and it will spill from mobile to stationary computing just because it can.

UPDATE
M$ is denying some of Intel’s assertions but won’t say which:
“On Wednesday, Microsoft took issue with James’ comments – but it declined to provide any clarification on what part or parts of her comments were problematic. “Intel’s statements during yesterday’s Intel Investor Meeting about Microsoft’s plans for the next version of Windows were factually inaccurate and unfortunately misleading,” the company said in a statement sent to The Register. “From the first demonstrations of Windows on SoC, we have been clear about our goals and have emphasized that we are at the technology demonstration stage. As such, we have no further details or information at this time.””

see Microsoft calls Intel’s Windows 8 comments ‘inaccurate’

Isn’t that hilarious? It sounds like a lovers’ spat. Are they due for a divorce? I detect slippage in the platform.

Further, in trying to clarify things, M$ says,
“”There will be four Windows 8 SoCs [system-on-a-chip architectures] for ARM. Each one will run for that specific ARM environment, and they will run new applications or cloud-based applications.

“They are neither forward- nor backward-compatible between their own architecture – different generations of a single vendor – nor are they compatible across different vendors. Each one is a unique stack.””

Talk about fragmentation… chuckle… and still no sign of legacy apps.

see Why are Microsoft and Intel slapping and pulling hair?
Playroom politics as MS lets ARM play with its dolly

Good fun!

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
This entry was posted in technology. Bookmark the permalink.

24 Responses to HAHAHA! Lose 8 Will Not Run Legacy Apps on ARM!

  1. Google is in the business of selling information like that. I have not asked their price but my wife would likely say I cannot afford it. Early on Google did publish stuff like that but they found it too valuable. Now they only give search trends for free.

  2. Linux Apostate says:

    “According to W3Schools.com,
    Linux in April 2011 was 5.1% of visitors.”

    You know, Google probably has pretty accurate historical data on how many Linux users are actually browsing the web, given that even if you don’t use Google you still get tracked by every website that uses Google Analytics or displays Google ads. Have you tried asking them? You might get further than you did with the census department.

  3. Amen. FREE SOFTWARE is a subset of Open Source software.

  4. Richard Chapman says:

    “Then it’s not open source according to your great spiritual leader, Richard Stallman.”

    Hey Dave, you’re talking through the wrong end. Richard Stallman doesn’t have anything to do with “open source” software. That’s Eric Raymond’s thing. RMS is Free software only. If you are going to try to tell FLOSS followers what they believe in, at least do a little research, otherwise you come off like the Ignorati you are.

  5. Of course software should be FREE. I don’t see any argument in favour of non-free software especially if it is something that can be widely used. Stuff like the OS, office suite, media players etc, are so widely used that there is no question that the world cannot produce the software in variety with good quality and features. If a billion people are using some software, those people can easily afford to pay the pittance per copy required to produce the software. Stuff that is highly specialized and used only be a few is certainly produced reasonable well as FREE or non-free software but either system can be used. There is nothing magical about M$ or any business that they can produce better software at lower cost than the whole world working on FREE SOFTWARE. Compared to the world, M$ is a tiny spec of humanity with no lock on ability to produce software. There ability to market their software is not due to its merit but exclusive dealing back in the 1980s and 1990s.

  6. According to W3Schools.com,
    Linux in April 2011 was 5.1% of visitors.
    Linux in April 2010 was 4.5% of visitors.

    Not falling, rising and considerably larger than 1%. The rate of growth of market share is 11% per annum, good by any standard.

    Even NetApplications shows
    Linux+Android/Linux in April 2011 was .94% + .66% = 1.60%
    Linux+Android/Linux in April 2010 was 1.05% + .09% = 1.14%

    so they are seeing 40% per annum growth in share.

    Again, not 1% or less and definitely growing.

  7. The Other Dave says:

    1% is the lowest of all estimates and it is based on a clearly faulty model,

    Another ‘la la la, can’t hear you’ moment then? You can bake up any imaginary numbers you want and deny the facts but Loonixland has less than 1% of the total global market. And it’s dropping.

  8. The Other Dave says:

    Stallman recognizes Free Software under several different licenses.

    “Why you shouldn’t use the Lesser GPL for your next library”
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/why-not-lgpl.html

    The gist is that it allows closed source to be attached implying that anything but the communistic approach of open sores is the only solution

    “Richard Stallman Talks On Copyright Vs. the People”
    http://slashdot.org/story/07/07/20/055206/Richard-Stallman-Talks-On-Copyright-Vs-the-People

    Stallman talks about how bad copyright is and how all software should be open source.

    Article on the BBC web site written by Stallman himself condemning proprietary software.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7487060.stm

    You should know your religious leader better if you’re going to be a good little open sores drone. He doesn’t want you or anyone else to use proprietary software. He wants world compliance. Sounds kind of like Osama Bin Laden.

  9. Stallman recognizes Free Software under several different licenses. The OSI recognizes them as well. What’s your problem?

    Google is using Free Software internally and promoting its use external in a huge way. They don’t have to do that but it makes good business sense to treat people well.

    1% is the lowest of all estimates and it is based on a clearly faulty model, samples of commercial sites heavily weighted to business in Anglophone countries. Sites like Wikipedia report dramatically different results for quite general-purpose widely used sites. Same with W3Schools.com, which, even though containing M$-specific stuff shows that NetApplications is an outlier.

    “An outlying observation, or outlier, is one that appears to deviate markedly from other members of the sample in which it occurs.”

  10. The Other Dave says:

    Android is not under GPL but it is still open source

    Then it’s not open source according to your great spiritual leader, Richard Stallman

    They definitely have some agendas but they never resolved to dirty tactics that M$ did

    Another “la la la, can’t hear you” freetard. Google jacked code from Sun/Oracle, has closed the source repository of Android 3.x, is in trouble with the EU over privacy, has attempted to commit theft of IP on a massive scale, the list goes on. But hey, keep covering your ears and pretend they’re your saint, it just makes you an easier target to laugh at.

    GNU/Linux desktop is a reality NOW

    At < 1% of the global population? Nice try freetard. Get your tinfoil hat and keep pretending.

  11. Bender says:

    Android closed source, hmm,i must have missed those links to download Android source code…

    1) Android is not under GPL but it is still open source
    2) ARM = competition, many companies competing with others, that means lower prices for consumers and no behind the counter agreements
    3)They definitely have some agendas but they never resolved to dirty tactics that M$ did
    4)M$ is starting to earn less and less on their cashcows which are driving the rest of their money losing divisions, the less these cashcows earn the better for all of us
    5)GNU/Linux desktop is a reality NOW, only M$ zombies like to pretend it doesn’t exist, and all the innovation happens in GNU/Linux. M$ is merely following and scraping ideas from others.

  12. The Other Dave says:

    You say you have 40 years of experience in technology and science, yet you write your posts like a pre-teen.

    That’s because he’s in denial about a few things:

    1) That Android is open sores.
    2) That ARM is some messiah that will save the world of open sores and strike down “teh ebil M$”
    3) That Google has no hidden agendas (oh like making money) but instead is totally dedicated to the open sores movement
    4) That Microsoft is dying
    5) That Linux desktop will be something other than a sad little experiment that only religious open sores zealots see as useful

  13. The Other Dave says:

    “Android/Linux is on fire on ARM.”

    Excellent, another closed source mobile OS. Glad to see you’re cheering for a closed source mobile OS.

  14. Last year I moved students and teachers of a K-12 school from XP to Debian GNU/Linux. No one complained that they could not do what they needed to do with the new set of applications except one teacher who had a personal collection of DVDs she wanted to show the kids. I was able to get that working on GNU/Linux but it was easy enough to leave her machine running XP. Another teacher who was hired after the change complained and we “upgraded” her to “7”. She was not happy with that. It would not do some of the things we used to do with XP like print to a printer on her desk. Another teacher was just set in her ways and refused to use GNU/Linux even though it would do what she wanted. So, out of hundreds of people only three kept that other OS alive in that school. The students in particular enjoyed the fact that GNU/Linux was much faster than XP or “7” on our machines.

  15. Zombie Chan says:

    “Well, for a product that has recently stopped “sucking”, it has done very well and I expect growth of acceptance will not slow down until a major share is obtained. ”

    That’s my point. Just because the product started out not as great, it gets better over time. Windows Phone 7, after the Mango update will give Android a run for it’s money.

    ” By the end of 2011 prices will drop precipitously.”

    If that is true, that would help Android take over the tablet market, I would buy the Xoom if it was 350$ or less, but not for the price it’s going for.

    “Yes, and these are a small minority of people who use PCs.”

    I would say the people I just summed up is a large minority, probably more along 40% of users of desktop(it’s fun pulling numbers out of my ass).

  16. Atom will take two or three years to catch up to ARM on mobile. In those two or three years, Android may approach one billion users.

  17. Linux Apostate says:

    I think legacy software support is probably more important than you realise. I am suspicious of surveys that reveal that most users only need a web browser and word processor, because in my experience absolutely every user has needed more than that, at least occasionally. But if you ask the user what else he/she needs, he/she will either forget or not know.

    I forsee a future generation of tablets and phones that have the same capabilities as the current generation, plus something extra – the ability to run Windows/x86 applications! Windows 8 on ARM was an opportunity to make that happen through emulation, but since there is not going to be any standardised ARM platform (still!!) it’s unlikely to even be available through third-party software. “Atom” it is, then.

  18. Well, for a product that has recently stopped “sucking”, it has done very well and I expect growth of acceptance will not slow down until a major share is obtained. I am on the fence about how well Google has managed this thing. It is presumptuous for them to assume they could do all the development in-house even with all their money. The result is over-tight control and perhaps tunnel vision. With wider support for the development of Android, it might have become better sooner. Perhaps it’s a chicken and egg thing. If they hadn’t done it in-house perhaps there would not be wide interest in it. In any case, they can open it further at any time later. I hope they do that but I am not confident because of their deliberate waste of energy to choose licensing other than GPL for most of it. I don’t think there was any technical reason for doing it the way they did. Even if fragmentation were a problem, most manufacturers would bet on the brand blessed by Google anyway. Whatever works.

  19. Zombie Chan wrote “Except for the .Net Developers(or any kind of developers that preferred MS Tools), PC Gamers, People who use MS Office for work, or people who just like using MS Software.

    Yes, and these are a small minority of people who use PCs. Gamers for instance are about 10%. People who use Office are mostly working in business in offices and are a larger group but certainly nowhere near 100% (probably about 40%). Typically, users of Office can have their needs met with OpenOffice of Google Docs just fine.

    Prices of tablets have been high because people were buying iPads but that has maxed out. They have actually accumulated 2 million iPads in the supply chain. By the end of 2011 prices will drop precipitously. Many folks are quite satisfied with sub-$200 tablets and more are coming out all the time. In principal, the tablet will be the lowest-cost client except for the thin client. The difference is mostly the touch-screen. I was watching TV the other day when an ad for a car came on the screen and it seemed to be running on a tablet… It turned out to be the manual for the car. Tablets are everywhere and are in huge growth. Now that the early adopters have one, the prices will drop rapidly.

  20. Zombie Chan says:

    Also Android use to suck when it first came out..

    I think Android stop sucking around 2.0….

    Windows Phone 7 is Microsoft’s attempt to make a better mobile OS. I think they’re doing a better job then Android 1.0

  21. Zombie Chan says:

    “Android/Linux is on fire on ARM. People are adopting Linux there globally by the millions. ”

    Yes, Android is a great OS, for a phone. A bunch of people are running Android on their phone. Android isn’t doing that hot in the tablet section. Windows 8 is suppose to be for Desktop, Phone, and Tablet.

    “That other OS has no advantages for many people. ”

    Except for the .Net Developers(or any kind of developers that preferred MS Tools), PC Gamers, People who use MS Office for work, or people who just like using MS Software.

    “Thus Android/Linux is on a level playing field with no opponent on the field for the next year or two”

    No opponents? What about Apple, Blackberry and Microsoft.

    “People want the small cheap computers and that other OS is not running on them.”

    Most good tablets running Androids are not cheap, it’s cheaper to buy laptop that’ll have more power to it.

  22. Android/Linux is on fire on ARM. People are adopting Linux there globally by the millions. Many people do not need the legacy apps from that other OS. That other OS has no advantages for many people. Thus Android/Linux is on a level playing field with no opponent on the field for the next year or two. People want the small cheap computers and that other OS is not running on them. Great.

  23. Zombie Chan says:

    You say you have 40 years of experience in technology and science, yet you write your posts like a pre-teen.

    If Windows 8 for ARM is not going to run all my Legacy Apps then I’ll just stick with Windows 8 x86..

    If they manage to port Powershell, Windows Live Mesh and Messenger, Visual Studio, Office, and .Net to ARM, it’s already more useful to me and my company then Android.

  24. Linux Apostate says:

    I have to agree with you on this one. Looks like Windows 8 on ARM will be about as useful as Windows NT on Alpha and PPC, i.e. barely.

    Sounds like they haven’t solved ARM’s big problem after all. This is the one I’ve written about in many comments on your blog:

    “””Intel is unified, James said, but ARM is Balkanized. “Windows 8 for x86 will run legacy, Windows 8 for x86 will run SoC.” In the ARM-based world, she said, things won’t be as simple. “There will be four Windows 8 SoCs for ARM. Each one will run for that specific ARM environment… They are neither forward- nor backward-compatible between their own architecture – different generations of a single vendor – nor are they compatible across different vendors. Each one is a unique stack,” she added.”””

    That’s bad. It impacts Linux and Android too. That’s four different board support packages (BSPs) to support four different SoCs… so, at least four different Linux kernels required.

    Why hasn’t this problem been solved? Politics would be my guess. Every manufacturer wants their own ARM solution, nobody wants to co-operate on a standardised architecture. Microsoft could possibly have forced them to standardise, but maybe it was just too much effort for too little reward.

    And no legacy application support? Oh dear, oh dear.

    I can only conclude from this that Microsoft really doesn’t care about the ARM platform beyond what they’re already doing with Windows Phone 7 and CE.

Leave a Reply