Canada Needs To Drive Smarter Electrically

“We continue to not hit our targets for reducing greenhouse gas emissions,” she says.
 
“We’ve already missed two complete targets. The 2020 target we’re not going to hit as well… During that same time that we’ve had all these targets, we’ve developed eight to 10, 11, 12 different plans, and our emissions just keep rising.”
 
See Canadian government gets ‘failing grade’ in climate change planning, says environment commissioner
Amen! At least someone in the Canadian government gets it. Business as usual is going to get us into some very unusual pain. It’s far better to cut fossil fuels out sooner rather than later. Driving smarter electrically is a low hanging fruit of this tree. Do the maths. With battery electric vehicles one can drive 4-5 times farther for the same use of energy and there’s no CO2 released in the process. Heating our homes electrically can be done too by switching from simple furnaces to high-efficiency gas furnaces or heat pumps. There’s a huge inventory of cars, homes, factories, schools and offices that could be converted rather quickly. Just get on with it. Set a goal or deadline and stick to it. I’ve already ordered my electric car and my home uses geothermal heating. I plan to add some photovoltaic panels in addition to our passive heating too. What’s holding you back?

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
This entry was posted in family, politics, technology and tagged , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

41 Responses to Canada Needs To Drive Smarter Electrically

  1. oiaohm says:

    Petey, bicycle tires are not speed rated.
    Grece what still talking to non existing people with crap.
    https://www.schwalbe.com/en/tour-reader/big-ben.html that a push bike tire.
    e-bike ready 50 on it description means it rated for 50 MPH. Yes those making fast push bikes or fast e-bikes have to watch what rating tire you use. There are push bike tires rated up to 100MPH or 160KPH. There are insane items that need the 100MPH bike wheels.

    There is a e-bike on the market that has a racing style push bike front wheel and is rated for 150KPH and yes you require 160KPH/100MPH tire for it. There is no outer shell on that e-bike. So Grece push bike tires do come in forms with speed ratings and is very important at times.

    That bike would never survive a crash test. Additionally, any side load due to wind will push it off the road.
    Grece the second part of your comment shows you did not use brain. That bike does not need specialty crash tests because bikes of that type are crashed regularly. You don’t ride one if you don’t expect to crash it. Those competition for max human power speed recumbent only has 2 wheels and lack stability and crashes. I wish I could remember find the video link on youtube but there is a video out there of the exact recumbent bike I referenced crashing and hitting something very solid and bike and rider being unhurt other than a little scuffing and bruises.

    Its insane to use one of those human speed bikes on open road as they do without them being designed to crash into on common truck because that will happen at some point. They are one of the most dangerous things allow legally on the road you would think. Shocking reality out of all the different crashes of the human speed bikes with carbon fiber shell there has being exactly zero fatalities and shock horror zero broken bones. Safety of those bikes come from the carbon fiber shell and the carbon fiber seat exactly matched to rider and the relatively low mass.. Really they are the true test of how much can be done without airbags. Airbags are optional choice really. Also people don’t notice how many race cars have airbags basically none because all the job of airbag in race car is handled with seat belts neck brace and helmet. Where you do test out some of the race car seat and belt designs insane in human powered speed record recumbent bikes so they are a source of real world crash test data for seats not for the bike itself. I found out about human powered speed record recumbent bike when read test data on racing car seats.

    Grece basically how long are you going to not accept you are clueless. Grcce you have been as normal absolutely clueless on this topic.

  2. Grece says:

    Well, for one Robert, they don;t go around driving Solo’s do they?

  3. Grece wrote, “There are no videos of that Robert, so hence, it did not happen.”

    What do you think Vancouverites do for fun in winter?

  4. Grece says:

    Robert, nice of you to interject and stand up for your buddy there (ignorant folk need to stick together), but I was referring to Fifi’s recumbent bike link.

    Solo has been driven…up into the mountains.

    There are no videos of that Robert, so hence, it did not happen.

  5. Grece wrote, “any side load due to wind will push it off the road”.

    You think there are no winds in the mountains of BC? Solo has been driven all over Vancouver and up into the mountains. There have been thousands of vehicle-miles driven in Solo and not one has been blown off the road so far.

    Further the same shape that gives Solo good aerodynamics, on par with some well known sports cars, helps resist deflection in a cross-wind. The good shape causes air to move smoothly around Solo on all sides and underneath. A cross-wind is deflected by that streamlined flow like a shield. Apart from storms and certain exposed locations on bridges etc. the worst case of cross-winds a Solo will likely experience is when passing or being passed by a tractor-trailer. Solo will encounter turbulence and abrupt changes in cross-wind in that case. We’ve seen Solo completely ignore such things in YouTube videos. It’s not an issue for normal situations. Of course, one should not drive in a hurricane or tornado or tropical storm. That’s just poor judgment, nothing to do with Solo.

  6. Grece says:

    That bike would never survive a crash test. Additionally, any side load due to wind will push it off the road.

    Petey, bicycle tires are not speed rated.

  7. oiaohm says:

    https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2011/08/25/u_of_t_engineers_design_bicycle_that_can_top_100_kmh.html
    Robert advocates for bikes. Next he will state that recumbent bikes are highway capable.
    Basically here goes clueless Grece again. Interesting is the highway rated recumbent bikes use the same kind of carbon fiber outer chassis as the Solo. Maybe if you had some research before your comment you might have known something.

    Please note that they don’t ride those highway rated recumbent bikes at 100km/h on closed roads so the outer shell does require a decent about of strength in case they crash it or get hit.

  8. Grece says:

    Robert advocates for bikes. Next he will state that recumbent bikes are highway capable.

  9. oiaohm says:

    One can even query the vehicle database, but alas, there is no reference to the Solo or EM manufacturer. Jerry is blowing smoke!
    https://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/database/VSR/veh/LatestTestInfo.aspx
    Grece go there and check the terms of listing. If you vehicle is defined not to require crash tests you cannot enter the tests there. And if the test are not listed there you cannot use it in any form of advertisement.

    Grece Solo is classed as too small to require crash testing. So this is a case we cannot find out if Jerry is blowing smoke or not because the rules don’t allow us to. Nothing you are referencing changes that fact. As normal you have made up facts to suit your point of view.

    That’s under the “show and display” exception, which applies to a select range of elite cars and has a miles-per-year restriction too.
    Kurkosdr beat me to this one Grece. So you were blowing smoke on that point as well. I was not kidding that once unapproved crash data is published importing into the USA without restriction is impossible. Something like the Solo it gets insanely problematic with the current USA rules that under a particular size crash test data will not be accepted so the list you searched is never going to have displayed solo data unless the rules are changed.

    One thing to mention Robert, you espoused about just having one-door on the Solo. What happens when you get stuck against a snow-bank and cannot get out?
    Grece please read the specs all Solo have 2 doors. Question is do both doors have hinges the answer is maybe no. The door that does not have hinges has a release completely latch what might in fact help you if you are crashed in a snow-bank. Something to take off and use as sled without requiring any tools. So general usage a solo might be one door crash its always 2 doors.

    Kurkosdr mono-tracer is highway rated in fact it autobarn rated being 200+km/h no airbag in steering wheel.
    Solo has too small of an interior to fit an airbag. Mono-tracer has side airbags and the data on if they save lives or kill is still up in the air. This is something with a close to same size cabin as the Solo. There are very limited small cabin vehicles made. Air bags must be fully deployed before person in vehicle comes into contact with them. What is fun for some people is some new trucks are also made using pure collapsing steering column no airbag for all markets for one problem where the airbag may not be deployed in time due to how compact the front of truck is so airbag would become a killer not a saver.

    Kurkosdr basically not everything can be fitted with airbags and improve safety.

    There are quite a few new highway vehicles that don’t have airbags because is unsafe to fit them. And if you cannot fit airbags the quality of the collapsing steering column and seat belts comes very important. So solo I would not question the missing airbags I would question the seat belting and if the collapsing steering column is good enough. Double shoulder strapping has been tested to produce almost the same results as airbags. Also in a single strap setup mono-tracer does something interesting.
    https://peraves.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/2011-12-03_05_mte-150.jpg
    Intentionally lift the lap belt height. This has the seat belt take more load so reducing force hitting steering column. This is the interesting point lot of the live saving of a airbag can be achieved other ways that don’t depend on doing calculations quick enough to decide to deploy or not deploy. But people do complain about the changes to the seat belt and some of the other changes being unconformable.

    no ABS is interesting. This is interesting because is the wrong feature. Solo is fitted with regeneration braking.
    http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/brakes/brake-types/regenerative-braking2.htm
    Interesting right you fit regenerative braking you fit one of the ABS controllers. It is possible to fit a second ABS mechanical controller on the physical brake plates but is is not in fact required in EV where no electricity is no go. You see a lot of EV that are not the solo who claim ABS but they only have regenerative braking controller. Also being electric you got traction control as well.

    ESP gets interesting as well. https://www.rqriley.com/3-wheel.htm Depend on how the front is designed in the solo and the drive system could turn out that it does not need one. Oversteer/Understeer in a 3 wheeler is directly linked to the application of breaking and power. So EV traction control plus EV regenerative braking plus only 3 wheels and produce the same results as ESP in a 4 wheeler or a 3 wheeler ICE.

    no ESP (duh, it’s a three wheeler)
    Kurkosdr this is wrong. Its not that is a three wheeler. ICE three wheeler having a ESP would be useful. Its that is a EV three wheeler ESP might be just another not required part. Its like the mechanical ABS when you have traction control and regenerative braking. So EV power system can see a lot of parts you see in ICE solutions not be required because they rendered pointless. Yes 1 less wheel does make some serous sense with EV because you not only lose wheel but you also get to reduce complexity for doing ABS and ESP functionality and even better doing ABS and ESP functionality with parts you would have had to include anyhow. So dropping a 4 wheel to 3 wheels in a EV allows throwing a few parts over the shoulder as well because they are now pointless.

    Kurkosdr please note I am not saying the solo perfect. There are faults in the solo like I would have like to see a proper roll over bar my self. The outer body is in fact carbon fiber shell so “no rigid roof” is also not exactly true. The roof of the solo is in the same class as many new cars pressed sheet steel roofs for strength. Yes those pressed sheet steel roofs have been known to collapse in. Thickness required in carbon fiber to get that strength was developed for the mono-tracer and mono-tracer decide to go above and beyond. So if the solo roof is not rigid enough neither are most cars on the road.

  10. Kurkosdr says:

    Tell that to Bill Gates and his Porsche 959.

    That’s under the “show and display” exception, which applies to a select range of elite cars and has a miles-per-year restriction too.

  11. Kurkosdr wrote, “you are claiming it is highway capable”.

    It’s not a “claim”. It’s obvious to anyone.

  12. Grece wrote, “What happens when you get stuck against a snow-bank and cannot get out?”

    Roll down the window and crawl out. Been there, done that. Even a car with two+ doors can head into a snowbank. Solo has two, BTW, and in a pinch there might be a way for a thin flexible driver to get out through the rear hatch. In the worst case the windshield is very large.

  13. Grece says:

    One thing to mention Robert, you espoused about just having one-door on the Solo. What happens when you get stuck against a snow-bank and cannot get out?

  14. Grece says:

    Seriously HamDong, you are a retard. Crash tests are performed cloak and dagger?

    LMAO.

    https://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/database/VSR/veh/LatestTestInfo.aspx

    One can even query the vehicle database, but alas, there is no reference to the Solo or EM manufacturer. Jerry is blowing smoke!

    EU cars cannot be imported into USA

    Tell that to Bill Gates and his Porsche 959.

    https://blog.dupontregistry.com/celebrity-cars/bill-gates-americas-richest-porsche-959/

  15. Kurkosdr says:

    Then you need to have a talk with Ohiohan who says that the Solo has too small of an interior to fit an airbag.

    Also, the damn thing has no ESP (duh, it’s a three wheeler), no ABS, no rigid roof, and you are claiming it is highway capable.

    A real electric car costs money and the Solo is not even an ersatz, sorry.

  16. Kurkosdr wrote, “an cramped one-seater golf-cart with no airbags and no highway capabilities”.

    Two things:

    1. Even rather large men have fit into Solo. Getting in and out is a bit of a challenge. Consider it exercise. Once in, everything is within easy reach, visibility is great and the seat is comfortable by all reports.
    2. Solo is perfectly capable of traveling at highway speeds albeit with reduced range, just like an ICEd vehicle which has maximum range at ~40 mph due to air-resistance and gear-ratios. For Solo, air-drag is the key element and its small size and shape help greatly. The ride is smooth and controls crisp. Everyone who has test-driven it likes the capability on a good road. It’s not for off road or very long trips but highways are its friend. I intend to do a lot of highway driving because I don’t particularly like the congestion and sites/smells/noise of cities. I’ve never needed an airbag and don’t want one. Seatbelts do wonders at the speeds I drive. Just a lap-belt saves most drivers up to 100km/h and I rarely drive that fast. Solo is not a golf-cart. It’s not a low speed off-road vehicle. It’s designed for commuting and errands and does that job beautifully.
  17. Kurkosdr says:

    Ohioham, only loons like you and Pog care about the Solo, an cramped one-seater golf-cart with no airbags and no highway capabilities.

    If you want a proper electric car, it is expensive. I ‘d rather buy a used gas burner and wait for someone else to pay for the advancement of science.

  18. oiaohm says:

    Grece USA people like to talk about freedom of the press but when it comes to crash tests data there is no freedom of the press in the USA.

  19. oiaohm says:

    Jerry been crashing-testing for about a year now. Isn’t it funny, that there is not one single video of them crashing testing a Solo? Not one.
    Grece publish a single photo of a crash test that has not been government approved and they are only approved if it demand that the vehicle requires them results in you having your roadworthy status scraped for good. So no ability to sell vehicle for on road usage ever. Its some of the reasons why some EU cars cannot be imported into USA or Canada because the countries where they are made demand open publication of crash tests so they cannot be road worthed in the USA or Canada no matter how good they are.

    This is why crash tests are performed so cloak and dagger for cars,trucks… going to the USA/Canada market. Most vehicles you will never see a single photo of their crash tests either let alone video heading into the USA/Canada market. Its all due to the regulation most car and truck makers are not going to risk it. This is also why when you see experiments they are normally performed on cars no longer on-sale where the regulator cannot hurt them any more in the USA.

    We need the rules around crash tests changed so we can be more informed when buying cars.

  20. Grece says:

    Crash-testing is in progress.

    Jerry been crashing-testing for about a year now. Isn’t it funny, that there is not one single video of them crashing testing a Solo? Not one.

    FYI.

    ANCOUVER, Sept. 18, 2017 /CNW/ – ElectraMeccanica Vehicles Corp. (OTCQB: ECCTF) (“Electra Meccanica” or the “Company”) is pleased to announce the volume and value of the Company’s order book and letters of intent as of September 14th, 2017. In total, Electra Meccanica has received 9 letters of intent from companies around the world (corporate orders) – one from Asia, two from Europe and six from North America.

    The combined corporate and retail orders amount to 19,845 SOLO electric vehicles and 24,202 Tofino electric vehicle models, totalling $1.604 billion (CDN) in anticipated purchase price value.*

    Although the Company has started very limited production at its Vancouver, British Columbia, facility, it is presently expected that larger scale production of the SOLO will begin by the end of the first half of 2018. It is also presently expected that large scale production of the Tofino and deliveries will begin in 2019.**

    “After many years of research and development perfecting our first in a long line of next generation electric vehicles, we believe that we are delivering the affordable solution to the masses and that our company will be a global leader in this indisputable growing market,” Jerry Kroll, CEO further stated. “We are confident that these orders demonstrate the market’s interest in our electric vehicle products.”

    As of September 14th, the Company has received retail orders for 579 SOLOs and 102 retail Tofinos with the balance order volume of each product being corporate orders.* All retail orders of the SOLO require a $250 refundable deposit, while the Tofino orders require a $1,000 refundable deposit. Corporate orders require a Letter of Intent and all orders are non-binding.

    Production begins next year; how much you want to bet that the commercial interests are supplied first, before private parties.

  21. oiaohm says:

    https://phys.org/news/2005-06-airbags-probability-death-accidents.html
    Kurkosdr this is not talked about that much. But particularly in compact cabins airbags can be more fatal than help. So this means the collapsible steering column has to be done more correctly no extra plastic crap around it. So that barron steering in the solo column is part cost and part requirement when you cannot use airbags.

    Yeah, right. The thing has no airbag, no rigid roof, no passenger cage, no bar-reinforced doors.
    Ok the air bag was was correct. But enclosed vehicle size of solo prohibits airbag in normal position. You can see this in the mono-tracer It has airbags being side airbags because it was required to have airbags at first it was tried on the steering column of mono-tracer only to be found to be fatal every single time. There are still questions if the side airbags of the mono-tracer in fact saves lives or kills people. The compact space problem starts making you question airbags. So a airbag on steering column of a solo would basically be death sentence. In some ways due to the restricted space a 4 point seat belt requirement would make more sense than any airbags. Why 4 point not 5 is to allow sliding into the passenger cage of the solo.

    No rigid roof true but this is not a requirement for road worthy of even a car. No passenger cage is absolutely false.
    https://electrameccanica.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/chassis_assembly_08feb16.png
    Its a half height passenger cage. You legs are running inside the battery compartments on each side. The panel material of that chassis is insanely strong. In some ways I am worried if someone runs into the back of the solo because that back plate is effectively a blade pointing backwards.

    no bar-reinforced doors. type of door on solo could have bar-reinforcing. Something that is overlooked is note when a solo has it doors open.

    http://i.huffpost.com/gen/4682588/original.jpg
    The battery compartment is reinforcing the bottom edge of the door. There is quite a bit of thickness at and high strength that point that a normal car does not have. Lot thicker reinforcing on the bottom edge of the door it also gives solo access trouble for those with leg issues. So bottom edge bar you find in car doors would not be required in a solo. Mid bar still would be good if that is still there.

    Kurkosdr
    http://canada.autonews.com/article/20160912/CANADA/160919990/electra-meccanica-takes-wraps-off-solo-commuter-ev
    Here is the stupid part. 2016 crash tests were performed on the solo. Then they were told they did not need to submit them then you are not able to publish the results of crash tests unless the government in CA or USA have accepted them as valid.

    So basically Electra Meccanica stuffed a stack of prototypes and get absolutely nothing for it. This is one of the classes of completely stupid regulation.

    No evidence at this stage. Until tests come out, these are pure speculations.
    Deaf Spy to see the results of the Solo crash tests we would need government regulation changed so makers can perform optional crash tests and the government has to accept or reject them not just reject them with the excuse not required. Its not like Electra Meccanica can kick up a stink over it while they need paper work signed off.

  22. Kurkosdr wrote, “on-road golf cart that doesn’t legally classify as a car”.

    Wrong. Lots of things don’t classify as a car but carry passengers legally: buses, trucks, low-speed vehicles, three wheeled vehicles etc. It’s not a golf-cart which are low speed vehicles. Solo is definitely not a motorcycle. See https://tinyurl.com/ycdboxul
    Millions ride bicycles and motorcycles on roads. Surely millions will buy Solo.

  23. Deaf Spy says:

    Solo is a very strong car.

    No evidence at this stage. Until tests come out, these are pure speculations.

  24. Kurkosdr wrote, “no airbag, no rigid roof, no passenger cage, no bar-reinforced doors.”

    Well, you’re right about the airbags. Solo is a very strong car.

  25. Kurkosdr says:

    Crash-testing is in progress.

    Citation needed. Source?

    You will be surprised. Solo is very well designed for front/rear collisions.

    Yeah, right. The thing has no airbag, no rigid roof, no passenger cage, no bar-reinforced doors.

    It’s a golf cart. Face it Pog: Electrics are expensive. A bunch of people will attempt to get some of the electric car mystique by buying an ersatz “electric vehicle” on-road golf cart that doesn’t legally classify as a car, most sane people will buy a gas burner and wait for the technology to become cheaper.

  26. Kurkosdr wrote, “no crash rating”.

    Crash-testing is in progress. You will be surprised. Solo is very well designed for front/rear collisions.

  27. Kurkosdr says:

    Go and have a look at the deprecation rate of golf carts.

    Who cares about depreciation if the value you get from it is crap? Which kind of idiot wants an on-road golf cart with no crash rating?

  28. oiaohm says:

    Vehicles ALWAYS depreciate very quickly, some more then others.
    Grece see you just admit that depreciate rates are different between Vehicles. Particular classes are slower than ours at deprecation.

    Comparing to Roberts lemon to a golf-cart is ignorant.
    Really its not when the same engine is used in both at times. Mechanically the Solo is closer to a electric golf-cart or scooter than a car. Yes electric scooters using generic parts in drive train also in the class of slower deprecation rate and the electric scooters using lot of custom parts in drive train deprecate quickly.

    So there is a trend here between how generic the drive train is and deprecation rate. This also applies up in your petrols and diesel.

    Really Grece you counter argument is your normally total ignorant thing.

  29. Grece says:

    Comparing to Roberts lemon to a golf-cart is ignorant. Vehicles ALWAYS depreciate very quickly, some more then others.

  30. oiaohm says:

    Kurkosdr
    Plus, the damn thing is a golf cart with no supercharging and no crash rating.
    Go and have a look at the deprecation rate of golf carts. They don’t deprecate like a stone. You can see 30+ year old golf electric carts going for almost new price. Mainly because you can buy complete new drive trains and steering parts. This is why I question your idea that solo will deprecate like a stone because there is a class it close to that does not deprecate very much at all. Yes using generic motors instead of custom made ones is a signature of golf carts.

  31. Kurkosdr wrote, “If you want a real car with real range, an electric car is an expensive buy that will depreciate like a stone.”

    As I see it, I and many others don’t need the range of their gas-guzzlers. Ours can drive all the way to Regina on a tankful but I can’t remember the last time we did that… I can’t remember the last time it drove even 100 miles, so all that baggage is just capital wasted.

    OTOH Solo may not actually depreciate for years as demand exceeds supply. I was tempted to offer #13 and extra $5K to sell his spot to me but then he was put back in the queue like everyone not from around Vancouver, so…

    What do you think the shelf-life of a Solo would be. I could drive it around the driveway a few times a year and keep it in spotless condition for 100 years. It would be a perfect museum-piece. What depreciation? It would be worth $millions… 😉

  32. Kurkosdr says:

    your life are still going = you are still going

  33. Kurkosdr says:

    I hear that, but a Solo EV has a low parts-count so depreciation expressed as $/year should be about half that of Nissan Leaf or Tesla or most ICEd vehicles.

    But your life are still going to have to eat the depreciation.

    Plus, the damn thing is a golf cart with no supercharging and no crash rating. Pass. I prefer to spend the same amount if money on a used gas burner and have money to spare for gas.

    If you want a real car with real range, an electric car is an expensive buy that will depreciate like a stone. And this is what is holding me back.

  34. Deaf Spy wrote, ” Knowing that Solo is put together of cheap parts and materials, it will also last less.”

    Facts not in evidence. Take the brakes, for instance. Wilwood are not cheap parts. They are good parts. So are the motor and controller.

  35. oiaohm says:

    Not only this is pure speculation. Knowing that Solo is put together of cheap parts and materials, it will also last less.
    Deaf Spy price and quality are not 100 percent related. The solo engine is well used design and model used in many other items for over 10 years including conveyor belts systems in mines that run 24/7. Why is the engine cheep because it mass produced in volume and has been for a very long time and it a chosen product when you need decades of 24/7 running. Not because of material quality its just cheap because millions are produced every year going to into different markets.

    The sheet material the chassis of the solo is made from has been used in aircrafts for decades. Its cheap because again is produced in massive volume and consumed in equally massive volume.

    Deaf Spy I could keep on going for all the materials making up the solo. All the designs have areas where they have been used that way before taken more level of stress than the solo can mechanically do ever without being crashed.

    Now if you take apart a Tesla and run the same check for supporting history the history is not there.

    Buying a Tesla what has more unique parts more new designs in engines without the decades of testing…. Yes the more expensive one has the higher risk factor based on how much testing the parts in it has in fact under gone.

    Deaf Spy basically welcome to being a idiot yet again. Price and Quality are not 100 percent linked. You need to look at 3 factors. Price Quality and Volume. Higher the volume an item is produced the lower is price for the same quality. Most of the Solo is high volume production this is what makes the solo so cheap while being fairly high quality parts.

  36. Deaf Spy says:

    Solo EV has a low parts-count so depreciation expressed as $/year should be about half that of Nissan Leaf or Tesla or most ICEd vehicles

    Not only this is pure speculation. Knowing that Solo is put together of cheap parts and materials, it will also last less.

    Btw, I did the maths and instead of getting a Tesla, I got a Volvo with a diesel engine.

  37. oiaohm says:

    but a Solo EV has a low parts-count so depreciation expressed as $/year should be about half that of Nissan Leaf or Tesla or most ICEd vehicles.

    Pure speculation Robert.
    Pure idiot comment Grece. Mobility scooters, Golf carts…. There are a long list of electric vehicle with lower than average depreciation.

    There is a universal thing of low unique parts count. The more generic the main drive line parts are the lower the depreciation rate because those parts are used in other things.

    Part of the second hand price is the price of repair and that is partly related to how generic the core parts are. So a solo with its high count of generics would be expected to some bias to better deprecation.

    Grece also your a idiot colder temperatures shorter time ICE engines last. So F-250 in Canada has a shorter lifespan than a F-250 in the USA. Basically its not Robert who is mechanically inept but you Grece for not allowing on the nasty effect of climate on mechanics.

  38. Grece says:

    but a Solo EV has a low parts-count so depreciation expressed as $/year should be about half that of Nissan Leaf or Tesla or most ICEd vehicles.

    Pure speculation Robert.

  39. Grece says:

    I’ve never been able to exceed 14 years.

    That’s because you mechanically inept Robert. My F-250, a diesel mind you, runs off of wood-gas, bio-diesel and diesel, runs beautifully and is surpasses 14 years as we speak.

  40. Kurkosdr wrote, “Electric cars are still expensive and getting into multi-year debt to buy an asset that depreciates like a stone”

    I hear that, but a Solo EV has a low parts-count so depreciation expressed as $/year should be about half that of Nissan Leaf or Tesla or most ICEd vehicles. Some people keep a car running for 20 years but I’ve never been able to exceed 14 years. Solo is different. The battery will almost certainly last me 10 years because I can tolerate a reduction in range and my garage is insulated and there’s just less to go wrong with Solo, like rust, bearing and brake failure. I don’t need battery longevity or price per kWh to improve for Solo to make a better car than an ICEd vehicle. Where I live (low population density, proximate to cities) a car is nearly essential. Walking is too slow, the government won’t let me keep a horse, and cycling is no longer my thing…

  41. Kurkosdr says:

    What’s holding you back?

    Price. You can get a used gas-powered car for as low as £2000. Even if it breaks and needs repairs, who cares, people buy more expensive TVs.

    Electric cars are still expensive and getting into multi-year debt to buy an asset that depreciates like a stone, which means it will have a small fraction of the value you paid for the loan plus interest, is not exactly a life goal for me (though it is for a large number of people for some reason).

    Let the technology mature and become cheaper (I am talking about electric cars with supercharging ability here, I would never buy a glorified golf cart). Then let someone else buy them new and eat the depreciation costs, so a nice buffet of used electric cars is formed, and then I will consider electrics. Let’s also wait and see how these batteries mature, because technology is still new.

    One of the reasons my family is still well-off even after 7 years of Greek crisis is precisely because we didn’t put money on deprecating assets like fancy expensive cars, like many of our social circle felt compelled to do pre-crisis. Sure, my parents bought new cars (something I don’t understand) but they bought affordable cars and kept them for long. Instead, we invested our income in appreciating assets (aka real estate in good location) which we now rent on AirBnB for extra income while others are still paying for some fancy BMW they couldn’t afford.

    Let somebody else pay for expensive BMWs and Tesla’s and bear the cost of advancing science.

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