The Latest Info On Electra Meccanica Solo

Jerry Kroll, CEO of EM, gave an inspiring presentation to young people at a school for Climate Justice Week. While he talked a lot about saving the planet by using renewable energy and battery-powered thingies, he gave a lot of information about the Solo:

  • First delivery will be to a restaurant in Vancouver this month,
  • production will be “2 or 3 a month” locally (I’m hoping this is a mistake and it’s really 2 or 3 a week…),
  • he has a NDA but there will be news about investment opportunities on Dragon’s Den showing in August,
  • Solo will be crash-tested, and
  • the Chinese partner can build thousands as can an Indian partner.

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
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109 Responses to The Latest Info On Electra Meccanica Solo

  1. Robert, the more you spread the word and provide the link to our site and to EMV, the more people will be interested. The more people interested, the more reservations. According to your own theory, the more reservations and purchases, the quicker EMV will be able to ramp up production. Keep up the good work and everyone: keep sharing ours and EMV’s links.

    http://smallev.com

    Come and take your place on the map. We’re now plotting Enthusiast,
    Reservation Holder and Delivery demographics as well as age
    demographics. http://SoloOwners.net

    And… Good News! Electra Meccanica has rolled out their customer referral program.
    Even more reason to spread the word! For more information, join us at http://SoloOwners.net

  2. kurkosdr wrote, “an assembly line capable of producing half a hundred vehicles per year would take a year to set up.”

    Nonsense. You saw their assembly line. A welder could build a copy of all their carts in a week easily. The rest is just standard racks and tool boxes. There are no robots etc. that need to be shipped from afar. The plan for local expansion is to build a small number of such assembly lines. The space is the critical factor and they’ve already lined that up.

  3. kurkosdr says:

    @DrLoser

    I think you should not vex trying to teach Pog that 2+2=5 is not a correct equation. You see, Pog is on an entirely different reasoning plane, the plane of chair + buffalo = rainbows or something. Or, to give another example custom_body_shop_garage + niche_product = mass_production_of_100s_of_vehicles_by_Q1_2018

    This is not a case of Pog rounding of some numbers till he gets what he wants. It’s Pog being selective about the reality he accepts. For example, Jerry has told that production will be 3 vehicles per month (a realistic target for a neigbourhood garage/custom body shop) yet he insists on the Q1 2018 date (despite the “delivery dates subject to change without notice” bit) and despite having 100s of people in front of him, and despite that even if millions of dollars rained from the sky (courtesy of Dragon’s Den) an assembly line capable of producing half a hundred vehicles per year would take a year to set up. Despite all that, Pog insists on his Q1 2018 delivery date.

    So, my dear Doctor, the only way to discuss with Pog is to point out reality to him and the contradictions in his assertions and let *him* come up with the excuses and the reality-bending goodness (which is the reason we are all here, right?)

  4. oiaohm says:

    DrLoser
    UTF-8 six octets.
    https://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2279.txt
    UCS-4 range (hex.) UTF-8 octet sequence (binary)
    0000 0000-0000 007F 0xxxxxxx
    0000 0080-0000 07FF 110xxxxx 10xxxxxx
    0000 0800-0000 FFFF 1110xxxx 10xxxxxx 10xxxxxx

    0001 0000-001F FFFF 11110xxx 10xxxxxx 10xxxxxx 10xxxxxx
    0020 0000-03FF FFFF 111110xx 10xxxxxx 10xxxxxx 10xxxxxx 10xxxxxx
    0400 0000-7FFF FFFF 1111110x 10xxxxxx … 10xxxxxx
    Yes the last line is fact 6 octets.

    DrLoser so yes the UTF-8 rfc 2279 standard does extend to 6 octets. The one 1 was questioned was not the 6 but the 7 and 8 ibm had done. It stops at 4 because the unicode standard has decided to lock out so many bit. Of course you are too big of idiot to keep you fact straight so start saying I failed so show something because that is what you said. If you go back on this site you will find I had no trouble proving 6. I did prove where the 7 and 8 come from as well. 7-8 is not usable with a standard conforming implementation. 6 octet UTF-8 is rfc 2279.

    So DrLoser about time you give up attempting to make point about what I have done in the past as well more often than not you are getting them wrong.

  5. oiaohm says:

    DrLoser
    Well, there’s that, plus her pitiable attempt to “prove” that the UTF-8 standard extends to six octets.
    I did have the early documents that it did. Of course you ignored that.

  6. oiaohm says:

    Um, Fifi, everybody can “do the fun one” on the van der Graaf generator.
    DrLoser read the next line you will notice I am talking about altering conductivity.

    Most people cannot alter there conductivity so they can touch a van def Graaf generator and not arch to another person. In fact my hair does not even stand on end. Wifi interference is directly linked to that. As normal you are as bad a grece at not reading the complete point before saying bogus. IRC is a chat log so you do need to read lot understand what is going on. So if you use that IRC log in context there is not a single lie there. Its just you guys are too big of idiots to understand what was said. There were a lot clues on what the wifi interference is caused by in that log.

    DrLoser I call you moron because you read one line out of context and think you know anything. Most of your attacks against me are based on nothing bar crap you have taken out of context. See just because the wifi one I had been disproven DrLoser went looking for another point but fails to read everything to see that the next line of mine in the IRC states a condition that not every human can do.

  7. DrLoser says:

    I always wondered about his “fun-one” comment…

    Wonder no longer, Grece, wonder no longer.

    Fif has two basic modes of discourse.

    1) Fun thing fun see I told earlier I don’t need to repeat cite how dare you petticoats! Electro-magnetic spectrum brain damage proud Prussian speak Anglo-Saxon fun thing you not know not know me reduplicate pigeon brain no pidgeon I kill pidgeons in flight with arc from positive left hand terminal to negative right hand terminal.

    2) You disagree with Fifi, Lady of the Night. My little red leather miniskirt is better than yours. Therefore you are a moron.

    Well, there’s that, plus her pitiable attempt to “prove” that the UTF-8 standard extends to six octets.

    Or her pitiable attempt to “prove” that via “Chinese clerical script.”

    Or … well, let’s face it, just about anything. I am now going to open up a competition for anybody on this site to quote a single thing that Fifi has said, and which makes any sort of sense whatsoever.

    (Warning: it’s a bit like masturbation. You will almost certainly go blind trying.)

  8. DrLoser says:

    If Jerry’s business model was so good as Robert says, then he would have no problem what so ever attracting venture capitalists, but that is not the case here and why I firmly believe this venture is doomed to fail.

    Which, of course, takes us beyond the simplistic (yet entirely opaque to Robert) concepts of classical economic theory, and into the area of venture capital. Something which, other than an allusion to Dragons’ Den — which will no doubt be must-see, train-wreck, compulsive viewing — Robert has yet to touch on.

    So then, Robert. I spent six years of my life in Silicon Valley, in the early heyday of Venture Capital. You know, a time when you could sell a proposal for online delivery of pet-food, backed up with little more than a sock-puppet, for a couple of billion dollars of investment.

    Now. That was a frothy time. It was an insane time, and we don’t really need to go into the specific reasons why, apart from the fact that people who threw either $250 or their entire 401-K into these doomed enterprises were basically semi-evolved amoebas with four vestigial limbs, an appendix, and generally a prostate gland.

    The thing I want you, Robert, to take away from that period — and God knows, we should all learn from history — is simply this: Venture Capital really hasn’t changed much in twenty years.

    Back then, if you as a VC invested in ten start-ups, you would expect eight to fail miserably, one to just about break even, and one to make something like 100+ times your investment. That was the model then. That is more or less the model now.

    So, here’s a question for you. Even if Jerry gets Dragons’ Den investment. Even if Jerry gets his first three or thirty or even three hundred electrical penny-farthings with a stabiliser and a shopping basket off of the production line(s).

    Do you seriously believe that this nasty, noisy, relatively expensive, dangerous, useless, shoddy, miscegenation of random Chinese plastic parts and some weirdo collection of off-the-fhelf lo-tech battery parts will actually appeal to a Venture Capitalist who is looking for a multiple of 100x (minimum) their investment?

    I’d switch channels and watch “Stars In Their Eyes” if I were you. All of this is utterly preposterous.

  9. Grece says:

    No, but it would be advisable to have a roadmap and a business plan and several millions of line-of-credit finance in the remote possibility that they need to scale this motability scooter up. Presently they have none of that.

    I wondered about that, for instance I was employee number two with a company sometime ago and the owner started up with a $35K investment and took a number of micro and macro-loans out. Last I looked, he is chairman of the board, with 100+ employees taking chewing on a $100M revenue stream annually.

    Jerry could just seek loans for the first ten units, then hundred then a thousand and so on. But, I do not think the profit margin is good enough, as Ol’ Jerry is looking for a free-ride of sorts. If Jerry’s business model was so good as Robert says, then he would have no problem what so ever attracting venture capitalists, but that is not the case here and why I firmly believe this venture is doomed to fail.

  10. Grece says:

    I always wondered about his “fun-one” comment, like, what is dummy’s definition of fun? Really, it could be a number of fetishes. Perhaps ohmie masturbates with those Marfan Syndrome hands while watching Animal Planet. It could be worse however, such as Asphyxiophilia, which in his case could do him some good.

  11. DrLoser says:

    Courtesy of Grece’s link:

    I can also do the fun one on the vandagrah generator.

    Um, Fifi, everybody can “do the fun one” on the van der Graaf generator.

    That’s kind of the “fun” principle behind the van der Graaf generator, you loon.

  12. DrLoser says:

    EMV can hire people and set up an assembly line for ~$100K and increase revenue in a few weeks.

    Technically, an increase in revenue from $0 to $5 is indeed an increase in revenue. Not a very useful one in this instance. Did the Sugar Plum Fairy vouchsafe to you the particular increase in revenue that can be anticipated in this case? Because if not, you are blowing smoke.

    Their setup is that simple.

    Very true. Their current set-up is basically smoke and mirrors, designed to extract $250 from gullible loonies like you. Which is even cheaper than funding a single production line. And certainly more profitable.

    They don’t need to pay people until they are working.

    And nobody has suggested otherwise. But unless you are proposing an infinite elasticity of labor costs and material costs, coupled with zero latency in things like bank financing and supply chain payments, then this statement is worthless.

    They can rent space for a monthly amount and some deposit.

    They can, they can. And pigs can fly, or at least glide towards the ground in an ungainly and ultimately futile way. “Can” is by definition pure speculation. Put some figures on it.

    They don’t have to start with a huge working factory.

    No, but it would be advisable to have a roadmap and a business plan and several millions of line-of-credit finance in the remote possibility that they need to scale this motability scooter up. Presently they have none of that.

    They can obtain the space and fill it over time.

    Your wife is in Real Estate, Robert. Ask her to verify your projections on this one. Then sit back and watch her fall of her chair laughing.

    With revenue all is possible.

    No. With sufficient revenue, all is possible. And as we keep telling you, Robert, revenue is the least important part of all this.

    Cash flow is vitally important to a start-up, which is what this is. Also, backers with deep pockets for the inevitable huge revenue-based losses in the early years. Not months. Years.

    I see no evidence of realistic cash-flow projections here.

  13. oiaohm says:

    Grece I did and you did not read it. So I am meant to keep on correcting a idiot who said I should not post about that stuff anyone. The EM stuff has nothing todo with the topic robert set down and in the past I had posted the peer reviewed paper you did not read.

    See? I don’t go on blogs and post that I have biological issues that cause wireless routers to drop offline. Now that IS out of depth!
    See you told me not to. So you have no right to be asking for a cite now. So get your ass back on topic you absolute idiot.

  14. Grece says:

    Proven science? HAH!…..you are a loon. Post a peer-reviewed paper on humans affecting transmission of any of the 802.11 standards.

    I kindly await your evidence, otherwise shut up, as Robert would say.

  15. oiaohm says:

    Grece please note you say you don’t going and post about blogs about EM fields and that is exactly what you did. The thing you are quoting is from IRC log. I mentioned in IRC when particular topic come up but then you TMR guys have been annoying me with it everywhere even that the proven science on it exists. Its about time you guys pull you head in over that one.

  16. oiaohm says:

    Grece really I have showing DrLoser one of the research white papers explain human interaction with em fields. So keep on bring up a lost point as much as you like. The EM effect I have is proven science.

    I don’t go on blogs and post that I have biological issues that cause wireless routers to drop offline. Now that IS out of depth!
    You are calling me a dummy. The reality here is only a total moron would attempt to attack me on this point. EM effects of humans based on emotions are documented this includes the 10m range. The effect is rare but not exactly uncommon.

    What is the next thing of mine you are going to quote that proves you are complete idiot. You posted after the one where I gave drloser the reference material by the way. So maybe you don’t know how to read.

    Reality you asked how I new about SAE standards importing stuff into Australia and exporting it I have to know about the standards required.

  17. Grece says:

    “i>Grece SAE J1634 was rejected from usage in Australia

    But we are not discussing Australia are we dummy? In fact, no one cares about Australia.

    Basically you were completely out of your depth.

    Oh?….lets discuss something out of depth shall we?

    <b.”At work I am not allowed inside 10 meters of the wireless access point while it working…On my bad days I get inside 10 meters of the wireless access point and everyone gets disconnected…My body seams to produce the right freq to screw up 2.4 ghz…I know I contain water but what is off..I can arc between fingers.”</b.

    Who said that? Why, you did dummy!

    http://techrights.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/irc-log-31072010.html

    Scroll down about half way, use F3 or Ctril-F and type “oiaohm”, look for the line that's states ”also have fun with wireless networks.” and read what was said.

    See? I don’t go on blogs and post that I have biological issues that cause wireless routers to drop offline. Now that IS out of depth!

    CHUCKLE.

  18. oiaohm says:

    Grece SAE J1634 was rejected from usage in Australia because if defective method instead you are looking at ADR81/02. Why defective method different driving condition requirements to petrol powered vehicles so making the number unable to be compared.

    So importing stuff in Australia SAE J1634 is toilet paper. If you are trading vehicles across boarders you do need to be aware of the different regulator requirements and who you have to submit stuff to.
    End of discussion,
    Exactly you were a clueless idiot on this topic who just wants to be insulting grece so you had to say End of discussion instead of admit that you were complete wrong.

    I am totally aware of SAE J1634 from the point of view that I cannot trust to import anything here and what was the regulation requirements for where it was used.

    So you did not mention anything I did not already know. Issue is I knew where those papers had to be sent an not sent and you did not have a clue for import into the USA at all. I know import and exporting of cars into Canada, USA, UK, France and Australia. Basically you were completely out of your depth.

  19. Grece says:

    The more pertinent question is, my little dyslexic wonder, would you have known about standard J1634 and J1711, had I never even mentioned it?

    End of discussion, if you wanna run around shooting kangaroos more power to you.

  20. oiaohm says:

    Also it get more fun if they need a FE Sticker. If Electra Meccanica submits the Solo information to the Canada equal to the EPA due to the joint relationship deal between the two they can use the FE Sticker and the information is not going to appear in the USA EPA database. Why because submitting to a proxy of the USA EPA counts as submitting to the USA EPA and the agreement between Canada and the USA makes it a proxy. So trying to get information about the Solo by searching the USA EPA is a complete waste of time.

  21. oiaohm says:

    Grece Tesla is a different case because they are making inside the USA. Tesla had the FE Label, Tesla got fined because they had failed to put their design battery up for certification to the EPA. Solo if it battery was not standard to be imported directly it would have to have it battery design approved by EPA and that would be the paper work you would be looking for. Solo standard battery design no paper work to find at the EPA. No paperwork to find at the department of energy because they don’t mandate the stuff goes to central records. So this leaves road worthy approvals.

    Grece I have not contradicted my self you cannot read and are absolutely clueless about the real requirements to import a car into the USA.

  22. oiaohm says:

    All electric vehicles fall under SAE J1634 and J1711.
    Grece those standard fall under energy.gov USA Department of Energy requirements not the EPA when importing stuff into the USA.

    https://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/basic-information-fuel-economy-labeling
    The data only has to be submitted to the EPA after sales are done between a USA supplier and customer.

    FE Label (window sticker) is not require if Solo is sold from Canada to USA citizen. FE Label is only require if they open a Solo dealership in the USA.

    Grece I have been looking at what is EPA required to ship a solo from Canada to a USA customer. You have been looking as a complete idiot at what is require in the case of a USA dealer selling to the USA customer.

    Grece this is the stupidity. SAE J1634 and J1711 requirement is USA Department of Energy so as long and the maker has done those tests and the information is in the paper work with item being imported in the USA everything is golden. The results of SAE J1634 and J1711 only have to be provided to the EPA if you need the FE Label (window sticker). Solo made in Canada/China shipped straight to customer no FE Label required so no submitting the results of SAE J1634 and J1711 requirements to the EPA.

    This is where USA regulation really need a tidy up.

  23. Grece says:

    Ol’ Hammy is at it with his verbal diarrhea again. I love how he over explains himself repeatedly, then a sentence or two later contradicts himself, then jumps subject matter trying to compare two opposing things, as if it makes any sense.

    All electric vehicles fall under SAE J1634 and J1711.

    I would also add that EPA regulations require fuel economy, energy consumption, CO2 and driving range values listed on the FE Label (window sticker) to be adjusted to more accurately reflect the values that customers can expect to achieve in the real world. EPA currently allows fuel economy, energy consumption, CO2 values, and range values listed on the FE Label (window sticker) for electric vehicles to be adjusted using one of the following methods:

    – by multiplying city/highway fuel economy and range values by 0.7 and dividing city/highway
    energy consumption and CO2 values by 0.7

    – using the vehicle specific 5-cycle method described in 40 CFR 600.210-12(a)(1)

    – using a method which is equivalent to the vehicle specific 5-cycle method described in 40 CFR 600.210-12(a)(1) (with prior EPA approval)

    – using adjustment factors which are based on in-use data (with prior EPA approval)

    Most electric vehicles typically use the first method.

    I am sure I left out some things, but the EPA testing standardization is routine and thorough, for anyone to say otherwise is an idiot. Right hammy? You’re a feeble minded nimbly that lives in a backwards nation, how would you know what laws apply in the U.S.?

  24. oiaohm says:

    Something else here to remember Grese the first prototype solos were done without any ability to make custom pack batteries so was using off the shelf battery packs. This is why the tray is so stock standard.

  25. oiaohm says:

    Just as does the Solo, all custom parts that take a a decent amount of time to manufacture. This is what we are trying to convey to Robert, but he doesn’t understand scaling.
    Parts that EPA are require to regulate. There are a limited number of parts that fall under EPA. Motor and Batteries. Everything in the chassis falls under different government department.

    The battery pack is not custom? Did you not witness the battery joining machine Jerry was showing attendees??
    Yes but the shape and style and cell type is all a pre existing design. What made me work that out was that the tray they are sitting in is also part of the pre existing design.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CQKkTIU3rI
    Take a real close look at the battery tray Grece. Its standard that is used in telephone exchanges and military vehicles like radar units. So that bit is already road approved.

    Why make a standard design battery on site. Simple if you have have a weld failure in a cell you need the same gear to fix it. Or a dud cell you can remove and replace with the gear to make. Order cells and weld them up into standard is more dependable than order battery and pray the welding was done properly and was not damaged in shipping some how. Individual cells not welded tolerate lot more damage to their shipping container than completed batteries.

    The 4 min mark in the factory tour gave a really clear picture of the multi battery pack configuration the solo is using. They are exact design match to the one using in military and some brand of golf carts. It is missing the out plastic housing that is in fact optional.

    The EPA does not “approve” DOD vehicles.
    This is in fact wrong when the DOD vehicle is produce by a third party civilian company to be able to deliver on road they have to do EPA approval were required. One little catch DOD classification means they don’t appear in the open to public EPA records on the internet related designs also disappear.

    It a little legality trick the civilian built vehicle only comes 100 percent DOD once it delivered.

    LOL, golf carts and this electric big-wheel is far different and scope and purpose, why even the batteries used are far different.
    Sorry no this is where you wrong not all golf carts use custom configuration batteries. Electric golf carts using the same batteries as the SOLO are road certified and EPA certified. It a fun one do all the brands of EV golf cards that are road registered on the USA EPA site you will find 3 brands missing and if you go inspect those 3 brands you will find the SOLO battery design that is a copy of a military design. Great the design classified because it used in DOD vehicles but many groups make it because the design is pure common sense how to assemble the battery.

    So basically as soon as I saw the battery searching the EPA site USA for approve and finding anything on the SOLO is highly unlikely. So you need to be looking at the government department that approves the chassis for on road.

    The Nissan and Chevy electric vehicles abide by IEEE and UL standards dummy.
    Nissan and Chevy in electric vehicles don’t use standard configuration batteries.

    https://cleantechnica.com/2016/09/03/chevy-bolt-chevy-spark-ev-battery-packs-compare-one-another/
    Like really those are not standard rectangle battery packs grece. Please note the single line of batteries that the solo has is required so that they are standard. So down both sides the solo does with not battery in the middle is require so they are classed as standard battery packs and slow down thermal runaway.

    The battery packs in Nissan and Chevy EV are no where near standard so they need a EPA certificate on them. Standard battery shape and replaceable with standard battery shape alters regulation requirements a lot. Yes the Solo is designed on the presume the batteries may be changed in future with other standard rectangular shape batteries.

    abide by IEEE and UL standards
    LOL no. If Nissan and Chevy were using IEEE standard in batteries packs they would be made of up rectangular blocks of batteries like the solo. Both Nissan and Chevy follow IEEE standards where it suits them. So the Solo is closer to pure IEEE standards than the Nissan and Chevy EV. The closer you are to standards the less certifications you need.

    Being to standard the way the solo is a battery fire will be slower and lower explosive force released. Yes the open back of the solo battery compartment says if there is a battery fire and explosion you would not want to be behind the solo the design is so the battery pack ejects and spreads to reduce burn. That is part of standard IEEE design as well. So in a battery fire the solo is one of the safer EV designs because it battery storage is standard.

    Grece basically stop being clueless and look closer at the way the solo battery packs are done and you will clearly see they are standard.

  26. DrLoser says:

    With revenue all is possible.

    Which is why, of course, there are dozens of companies out there doing this. Well, actually, there are. There are in fact thousands of “companies” out there ripping off senile old fools at $250 a pop with legally acceptable promises that will never come to fruition: see Kurks, below.

    Never mind, Robert. With magic mushrooms, all is possible.

    And then you wake up with a headache, a bucket full of your own vomit, and $250 missing from your bank account.

  27. DrLoser wrote, “you’re expecting an immediate investment in fixed and variable costs of something like $3 million per quarter, Robert?”

    Nope. Not even close. EMV can hire people and set up an assembly line for ~$100K and increase revenue in a few weeks. Their setup is that simple. They don’t need to pay people until they are working. They can rent space for a monthly amount and some deposit. They don’t have to start with a huge working factory. They can obtain the space and fill it over time. With revenue all is possible.

  28. DrLoser says:

    To get 300 per quarter they need only to make 25 per week.

    So, you’re expecting an immediate investment in fixed and variable costs of something like $3 million per quarter, Robert? Even the most Candidian of Pollyannas would find that hard to believe. Particularly since it would be backed by an initial investment of 300 * $250, which if my maths are correct comes to a cool $75000.

    That’s easy with 6-8 assembly lines. They have the space.

    And if they kicked off with any more than one, two at max, assembly lines, you know what, Robert? Their deep-pocket investors, who are mythical in the first place and will remain so, would drop them like a hot potato. (Rather than the soggy French fry that they actually are at present.)

    The assembly lines are pretty simple to replicate.

    Interesting. Hitherto you have failed to mention your fifth previous career as a production engineer in automotive, Robert.

    Parts can flow once revenue comes in.

    Now might be a good time for Grece to educate you about cash flow and supply chains, Robert. That is, assuming that he can be bothered to lecture a child. As I recall, you regarded his previous Econ 101 effort as “a nuisance.”

  29. Grece wrote, “no one wants a stupid single-passenger mobility scooter.”

    [SARCASM]
    I guess that explains why they have many hundreds of deposits…
    [/SARCASM]

    I for one want one. Heck, I want two, but I have to work on TLW…

  30. Grece, failing to read the lines at all, let alone between the lines, wrote, “Production will be 2-3 per week to start.
     
    LOL…how can you say that when they cannot even produce one a month now?”

    You’ve seen the assembly line. How long do you think it takes one vehicle to emerge from that? I’d bet with practice they could do one a day easily. I’ve worked on an assembly line. It’s very efficient with no wasted motion and a balanced line is amazing. I worked in a tractor factory which was attempting to produce 6 tractors per day. We managed 5. Those tractors were much more complex than Solo, so it took more workers, more work-stations and a bigger facility. Solo is tiny and with a low parts-count. When they have practice, the rate of production will rise dramatically. It’s like tying shoes. How long did it take you to do your first? How long does it take now? That’s practice. The reason they haven’t produced more than one a month is not because they can’t but because they need certification to put those vehicles on the road. That’s no longer a bottleneck apparently.

    Grece also wrote, “There is only room for ONE assembly line.
     
    To get 300 per quarter they need only to make 25 per week.
     
    Of which, they will never be able to scale to.”

    The assembly line shown was the prototype of their assembly line. They have a whole factory planned for expansion at Abbotsford. Here’s the mayor of Richmond BC examining a Solo. Mayors just love new businesses to move in.

  31. Grece says:

    That was a slip of the tongue.

    Jerry was speaking truthfully, it was not a slip of the tongue. You are only wishfully hoping that is the case.

    Production will be 2-3 per week to start.

    LOL…how can you say that when they cannot even produce one a month now?

    It’s a small car.

    Yes, this is why there is NO MARKET for such a thing, Robert Pogson, is not a market.

    It doesn’t take that long to assemble.

    There is no track record, now you are making assumptions when they cannot even make a single unit in a month.

    After a handful are assembled at that rate further assembly lines will be put into production.

    There is only room for ONE assembly line.

    To get 300 per quarter they need only to make 25 per week.

    Of which, they will never be able to scale to.

    That’s easy with 6-8 assembly lines.

    Where are they going to get the room for that? You sound just like hammy, I swear. Assumptions backing assumptions, you are delusional.

    They have the space.

    No they don’t.

    The assembly lines are pretty simple to replicate.

    So simple, they cannot build one a month, eh?

    Parts can flow once revenue comes in.

    There is no revenue that will come in, as one they are broke and no one wants a stupid single-passenger mobility scooter.

  32. Grece says:

    I’m quite confident that…Solo will be mine in 2018.

    Oh yea?…wanna bet a bitcoin on that?

  33. Grece says:

    He/she forgets that the deposit is refundable… Further, suing anyone for $250 is probably a waste of time.

    Of course it is a waste of time, this is why the value is low to begin with. NO one is going to sue over $250, this is how the scam works.

  34. Kurkosdr wrote, “production will be 3 cars per month”.

    That was a slip of the tongue. Production will be 2-3 per week to start. It’s a small car. It doesn’t take that long to assemble. After a handful are assembled at that rate further assembly lines will be put into production. To get 300 per quarter they need only to make 25 per week. That’s easy with 6-8 assembly lines. They have the space. The assembly lines are pretty simple to replicate. Parts can flow once revenue comes in.

  35. Kurkosdr wrote, “which means that the seller can postpone the shipping date to Q1 of 2028* and then postpone it again without breaching any promises, which means Pog can’t sue and win.”

    He/she forgets that the deposit is refundable… Further, suing anyone for $250 is probably a waste of time. I’m quite confident that the sun will rise tomorrow and Solo will be mine in 2018.

  36. Kurkosdr says:

    And presumably a share of the Brooklyn Bridge,

    Ahem… Anybody who got coned into buying the Brooklyn Bridge can sue the “seller” and win. Pog placed an preorder for a product with a delivery date that “can change without notice” aka be postponed indefinitely, which means that the seller can postpone the shipping date to Q1 of 2028* and then postpone it again without breaching any promises, which means Pog can’t sue and win.

    Which brings me to my sales pitch: Give me $250 and I will build for you a fully functional copy of the Brooklyn Bridge, at your desired canyon/canal, to be delivered in Q1 2018 (delivery date subject to change without notice)

    *not entirely unlikely, Pog is number 401 best case scenario, and production will be 3 cars per month

  37. DrLoser says:

    I’ve paid $250, have a reservation, received a signed copy of a bright red Solo …

    And presumably a share of the Brooklyn Bridge, denominated in pre-WW1 Imperial Roubles.

    Still, bright red is a really nice colour, and it’s not as if you could have used that $250 towards the next version of Beast.

    Mazel Tov!

  38. Kurkosdr says:

    DrLoser’s question was specific: What is your order number? Round it off to the nearest multiple of 10 if you are worried about privacy.

    Do you know the number?

    Do you know the number and are afraid of being mocked?

    You are not getting anything in Q1 2018, or in 2018 in general, so all your preparation ritual was for nought, deal with it. But I am sure the signed copy was definitely worth the $250.

  39. DrLoser wrote, “Do you have an order number? And if so, given the obvious fact that production won’t start until the first quarter of 2018, and will be in small batches, what number is that?”

    Huh? He hasn’t been listening. I’ve paid $250, have a reservation,
    received a signed copy of a photograph of a bright red Solo, planned a route to drive back from Vancouver or Calgary, and I’ve written about all I can without a Solo on the property. I expect to ha e mine in Q1 of 2018. The proposed delivery schedule is certainly achievable.

  40. Grece says:

    Further, deli sits around at room temperature at a party for hours with no ill effect.

    Wow, just wow, you would never be able to operate a food business Robert. The food inspector would surely shut you down post-haste.

  41. DrLoser says:

    You haven’t listened to a word anybody said here, Robert, have you? (Apart from th psychotic idiot iaohm.)

    First question, posed by Grece. Do you have an order number? And if so, given the obvious fact that production won’t start until the first quarter of 2018, and will be in small batches, what number is that?

    I’m guessing that you don’t have one. And I’m guessing that even if you do have one, it will be somewhere in three figures. In which case, you won’t see one of these pathetic motability scooters with an extra wheel and a dubious carapace until 2021 at the earliest.

    Now, if you really want to do the Earth a favour, you should spend your time persuading TLW to ditch the SUV and replace it with a his’n’hers pair of second-hand Nissan Leafs. Or even one second-hand Nissan Leaf and a ten year old Ford flat-bed truck.

    TLW doesn’t need an SUV to commute 15 miles. Both of you need something like a flat-bed truck to haul deer carcases around in.

    What is wrong with you?

    This cretin mode of transportation will never happen. Get real. Get Green. And for God’s sake stop complaining that, say, Ikea have the effrontery to charge for an electrical top-up station.

    Nobody owes you a living.

    Start earning one by persuading your Climate-Changing Wife to change her ways.

    Alternatively, get back to us when EM somehow gets money out of Dragon’s Den.

    Because that is not going to happen either. You senile old fool.

  42. oiaohm wrote, “Biggest question with solo is does it have a 12 volt point in the front cargo space and how badly will performing heating/cooling effect range.”

    I don’t think there is a 12V outlet in the front cargo space but it should be a tiny modification to install one. I doubt it’s necessary for a five-minute trip from the retailer to the customer. Just as some container can keep a pizza hot, some containers can keep deli cold. Further, deli sits around at room temperature at a party for hours with no ill effect. So does pizza although I prefer it hot.

  43. Grece wrote, “The Solo is a scam.”

    Garbage in and garbage out on your logic then. The Solo is a well designed highly efficient electric vehicle. It’s not a scam. EMV has done a great job considering the size of the operation and will bring a good product to market starting this month. It’s been a long time coming and EMV has not faltered. They kept moving ahead while the likes of Grece kept repeating that they could not do it. Fools. Like Trump they believe if they repeat a lie often enough it will come true.

  44. Grece says:

    Grece EPA with electrics is report what is contained. There is no in fact certification stage.

    The EPA certifies all vehicles dummy, the Solo is no exception.

    Tesla contained custom parts.

    Just as does the Solo, all custom parts that take a a decent amount of time to manufacture. This is what we are trying to convey to Robert, but he doesn’t understand scaling.

    So need EPA certificates on those parts.

    The EPA provides certificates, the manufacturer does not provide those, dummy.

    Solo is interesting the individual battery cells are not custom the motor is not custom.

    The battery pack is not custom? Did you not witness the battery joining machine Jerry was showing attendees??

    Solo does not need a special EPA certificate.

    Again, it does so and again you are still a dummy.

    Even that battery cell layout in the Solo is not custom.

    Loop back to what I stated about the battery joining machine.

    Yes they are making batteries on site but it to existing layout pattern that was already approved for of all things particular models of golf carts.

    Quit contradicting yourself, damn. LOL, golf carts and this electric big-wheel is far different and scope and purpose, why even the batteries used are far different.

    Gets even more warped those slide in and out battery trays they are taken from military vehicle already EPA approved as a add-on.

    The EPA does not “approve” DOD vehicles.

    Really complete grese moron who does not have a clue of the regulations.

    I dare you to eat deli meat not kept in a climate controlled environment, and we shall see who has the “clue” on regulations.

    Solo gets out of having to-do a lot of regulation jumping by using a lot of design parts that are generic and already approved.

    Approved by whom? If that is the case, then why does Jerry even mention certification dummy? Can you even keep your story straight?

    The leaf and the volt battery configuration are not existing standards. EV makers can make their life hard or make their life simple all based on how much stuff they do to existing standards.

    The Nissan and Chevy electric vehicles abide by IEEE and UL standards dummy.

    Solo Electra Meccanica is a pure example in generic how much of a EV can be done stick purely generic pre approved stuff.

    The Solo is a scam. Just like you dummy, known as a liar and a fraud.

  45. Grece says:

    Hey dummy, Greens and Beans deli is not a pizza place, and if catered deli is not kept at the proper temperature it goes bad and people become sick. God, you are an idiot of the nth degree!

    Get off the pizza kick, not going to happen. Also, were you by chance, the drunken skateboarder? I would suit you as unintelligent as you compose your diarrhea here.

  46. oiaohm says:

    Grece EPA with electrics is report what is contained. There is no in fact certification stage.

    NO you are dumb. All electric cars must be certified by the EPA and issued a certificate of conformity you dolt. Tesla did not do this years ago, and had to pay $275K in fines dummy.
    Tesla contained custom parts. So need EPA certificates on those parts. Solo is interesting the individual battery cells are not custom the motor is not custom. Solo does not need a special EPA certificate. Even that battery cell layout in the Solo is not custom. Yes they are making batteries on site but it to existing layout pattern that was already approved for of all things particular models of golf carts. Gets even more warped those slide in and out battery trays they are taken from military vehicle already EPA approved as a add-on.

    Really complete grese moron who does not have a clue of the regulations. Solo gets out of having to-do a lot of regulation jumping by using a lot of design parts that are generic and already approved.

    The leaf and the volt battery configuration are not existing standards. EV makers can make their life hard or make their life simple all based on how much stuff they do to existing standards.

    Solo Electra Meccanica is a pure example in generic how much of a EV can be done stick purely generic pre approved stuff.

  47. oiaohm says:

    Robert, Robert…a catering service cannot deliver food in a unapproved vehicle, they would be fined.
    Grece so making crap up again or is there something in USA law.

    Australia and Canada as long as it road registered, commercial insurance is done you can use anything for food deliver that can in fact transport it correctly. If you want stupid in Australia is roller skates is vehicle.

    https://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.au/news/drunk-skater-crashes-in-front-of-patrolling-police/1115132/

    Yes it has wheels you ride on it while drunk you can lose your car license in Australia.

    The regulation in Australia and Canada is the housing around the food. Heated pizza delivery bags many of them would fit in a solo back and would be able to be powered in that location. Biggest question with solo is does it have a 12 volt point in the front cargo space and how badly will performing heating/cooling effect range.

    So as long as the food in correct housing will go into the solo it legally usable. Question is will it be practical. The reality here is stack of small pizza deliveries and allowing 2 cars per parking position may make the solo or something the solo size the ideal choice for this.

  48. Grece says:

    10 cubic feet of cargo space will hold a lot of catered goods: salads, sandwiches, cold platters…

    Robert, Robert…a catering service cannot deliver food in a unapproved vehicle, they would be fined. Greens and Beans deli had a special-use truck, an electric Solo would never work.

    The Solo would never be able to accomodate all this food, let alone the weight of the ice.

  49. Grece says:

    OH yes, EVERYTHING you read and see on the internet is true. *rolls-eyes*

    Since you bring it up Robert, why not get a Prius then? You won’t have to wait very long, you could get a used one for the price you are willing to pay for the Solo. That way, you can drive that for the environment, while waiting on the delivery of the Solo. Unless you are just talking bunk as usual, as it seems you only complain and whine about non-issues in your life, never following your own advice and make wrong decisions which leads to more failings.

    I honestly think you should put that free Canadian healthcare to use and see a psychiatrist, as your decision making process is illogical. How long has it been that you have been talking and gloating about a thin-client server, but to date not done a single thing to remedy it? The same thing applies to an entire host of other maladies.

    People wouldn’t be so critical of you, if you just got over yourself and just start making solid decisions instead of weaving these fantastical stories on why people need to do things your way.

  50. Grece wrote, “Well, it is most certain that they won’t be making any food deliveries in that.”

    10 cubic feet of cargo space will hold a lot of catered goods: salads, sandwiches, cold platters… EMV put $hundreds of groceries from CostCo in a Solo. It wasn’t difficult.

  51. Grece wrote, “no one delivers pizza in a Prius. Pizza delivery drivers use their own vehicles, and if they can afford a Prius, well, they wouldn’t be working at a pizza delivery store would they?”

    See https://www.google.ca/search?q=prius+pizza+delivery+vehicle

    I don’t know whether Grece is a fool, liar, idiot, trouble-maker or all of these. He certainly doesn’t understand that small is beautiful for many purposes.

  52. Grece says:

    Unless…Could…Assuming…Would…Could…Assuming…Could.

    Listen to yourself, you are basing your premise on theory. Nothing you have stated is factual, it is all fantasy. Besides, no one delivers pizza in a Prius. Pizza delivery drivers use their own vehicles, and if they can afford a Prius, well, they wouldn’t be working at a pizza delivery store would they?

  53. Grece says:

    That vehicle, #1, BTW, is apparently the one being delivered this month to Greens and Beans Deli

    Well, it is most certain that they won’t be making any food deliveries in that.

  54. Grece wrote, “it states that they have >20,000 refundable orders”.

    That’s a “fleet” sale and will come from Chinese production unless a big Canadian plant gets built. Lots of businesses could use Solo for making deliveries and break even quickly because of mileage. They could invest in EMV on the prospect of being first in line. Businesses that are thoughtful see the writing on the wall and for any role that doesn’t require multiple passengers or huge freight capacity, a small EV could well be the ticket.

    A lot of pizza places used Prius for such roles but the range of a Solo is enough to make them viable. Assuming a lot of deliveries, a Solo would be much more efficient because an extra engine and seats don’t have to be dragged around, just pizza. On each mission, a Solo could be plugged in upon return and recharge in 15 minutes or so, assuming delivery is made within ~5 miles. Solo gets about 200km range on 3h charge so 16km takes 15 minutes to recharge and 12 such trips could be taken between charges. A chain of pizzerias could well promote itself by advertising the use of EVs for delivery.

  55. Grece says:

    I happened to find an article from 2016 on Electra Meccanica, it states that they have >20,000 refundable orders. If that is the case, then that would mean they took in $5M dollars. This is the only instance I saw that large of a number of orders. Seems someone is blowing smoke!

    http://www.autoblog.com/2016/08/04/electra-meccanica-solo-ev-sales-start-next-month/

    Further thinking, the alleged R&D that has been done. Where is the information for that? I want a year of daily driving on record, so that I now that all the bugs are worked out. The expected lifespan of a modern car is 200K. So I want several cars out on the roads racking up two million miles between them. Or a least a million. They don’t pay me for troubleshooting, I pay them for a fully developed product. You wanna give me a Meccanica straight up in return for my input? No problem. I personally know a wiz-kid ME, I professionally know a guy in Florida that builds electric racing golf carts, we would be happy to “review” the electric big-wheel.

  56. Grece wrote, “In all fairness, the very first production unit was sold, well auctioned off for $21K.” and then went on to be very unfair, speculating out of nothing, “I wonder what percentage the $21K went towards the hospital?”

    That vehicle, #1, BTW, is apparently the one being delivered this month to Greens and Beans Deli in New Westminster BC. Good on them to support a worthy charity.

  57. Grece says:

    In review of Electra Meccanica dealership program, page thirteen on the PDF shows a lovely iMAC and iPAD for submitting reservations, receiving newsletters and scheduling test drives. Pog won’t be happy.

    http://electrameccanica.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Dealership-Info-Package.pdf

    So this dealership is like a franchise agreement, in that, you abide by all Electra Meccanica rules.

    The initial investment range is estimated to be $75,000 to $200,000 depending on the store size and condition, dictating the amount or renovations and leasehold improvements required.

    Robert, why don’t you cash out and open a store in Florida! Think of all the senior citizens like yourself that you could help by spending their retirement on a glorified mobility scooter. For the good of humanity, think of the planet and do something worthwhile with yourself, instead of complaining about life in general and non-existent monopolies. Why, if you do exceedingly well, you could shack-up with some strange on the beaches of Daytona and enjoy the warm weather with margarita’s.

  58. Grece says:

    In all fairness, the very first production unit was sold, well auctioned off for $21K. At least that is what Electra Meccanica Instagram page states.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/BKMWtVtBWVQ/

    I wonder what percentage the $21K went towards the hospital? I bet 5% perhaps 10%, but nothing more.

  59. Kurkosdr says:

    Pig = Pog (autocorrect)

  60. Kurkosdr says:

    and accept that your wife’s choice of vehicle is despicable and contrary to all the things you claim to hold dear.

    If TLW was more confident with tech, aka if Pog wasn’t all like “computers are a man’s domain, you can’t possibly understand it, here have this POS thin-client and trust me” I bet TLW would be using a Windows PC and a Mac, and an iPad. She looks like a person with a life and interests. But you see, Pig is never gonna give up that control. Remember the hissy fit when TLW demanded Windows to do her job?

  61. Kurkosdr says:

    We are talking about the cashflow available from each sale to buy parts for the next unit.

    Which brings the question: Since every car carries more than a week of labour (of many people) and that EM is most likely custom-ordering the parts (sorry, no mass production of parts for a mere 1000 units or so, because it won’t even pay for the cost of the stampers), does EM actually make a profit from each car? These guys claim to sell a mostly handmade electric trike for 11.000 USD. Hmmm…

    Not that it matters. Under the promised 3 cars per month rate, you are 11 years away from getting your Solo absolute best case scenario. So, you supposedly want an EV right now but you are willing to wait more than a decade to be given the right to spend 11.000 USD for an electric trike with no proven reliability record. When you could buy an electric car right now with a proven reliability record. Riiight. I guess this is yet another case of “poor beast” always being replaced with an ARM board but never actually getting replaced.

  62. Grece wrote, “to calculate your break even point”.

    It’s you who are talking about break even. We are talking about the cashflow available from each sale to buy parts for the next unit. It’s there. Break even will be years down the road for EMV but it will happen. No one imagines they could break even for the first few units but they will have revenue. That’s what’s necessary to keep the company going. Eventually revenue will catch up to their capital cost and accumulated expenses. Also, when they have revenue, an IPO will make a lot more sense and they can ramp up production with more investment. It’s all good and Grece keeps looking in dark corners of his mind for reasons EMV won’t succeed.

  63. Grece says:

    You should go out into the playground with the other kids…

    Well, at least you admit that our resident dummy has the faculties of a 5-year old. What took you so long to come to this conclusion?

    Dear Robert, “gross margin” has no bearing to the “break-even point” that dummy was trying to educate me on was it? These are two dissimilar terms used in standard accounting practices. I am not going to set down and give you a 101 lecture on accounting, but to calculate your break even point:

    Fixed Costs ÷ (Price – Variable Costs) = Breakeven Point

    I’m nuisance? A nuisance for what? Calling out a hypocrite and bullshit? Fine, I can live with that.

    A Solo went to China? Which number and color was this??

    Tootling around Vancouver you say? But they cannot sell one single unit.

    The one that went to Ontario was brought there in a trailer, hence the missing front license plate.

    Quebec? Jerry made no mention of Québécois, tu es completement débile!

    The certificate of conformity is issued by the manufacturer…the EPA responds with a certificate of conformity

    Ok, you are confusing me, which is it? Your contradictory logic makes no sense.

  64. Grece wrote, “I have no freaking clue as to what point you are attempting to make.”

    You should go out into the playground with the other kids…

    BTW, Jerry did publish his “gross margin” on a unit in his SEC filings. It’s 25%, plenty enough to buy parts from sales. I had estimated 50% but that was assuming high-volume/lowest cost parts. It’s understandable that the first units will have lower margins if they are ordering parts in small quantities. Shipping costs from China really plunge per unit when you fill shipping containers. I can’t do that and EMV likely can’t until next year, but they will eventually.

  65. Grece, going on to be a greater nuisance, wrote, “Ten you say dummy? I have only seen a white and black unit in review.”

    Let’s see. One went to China. Several are tootling around Vancouver. One went to Ontario for Dragons’ Den and one went to Quebec for certification. Jerry Kroll has mentioned ten prototypes several times and we saw a couple on the assembly line.

    Grece wrote, “All electric cars must be certified by the EPA and issued a certificate of conformity you dolt.”

    The certificate of conformity is issued by the manufacturer, you dolt. It’s about labelling and classification. The only specs are telling them what kind of battery, and motor are involved. This looks like one of the regulations that Trump promised to eliminate… The process involves sending the EPA a fee and two computer files… The EPA responds with a certificate of conformity and the maker affixes its own labels to the vehicles. It’s book-keeping. That’s all.

  66. Grece says:

    Grece those delivery quota numbers are normal. The thing you are not allowing on the the snowball effect. High mark-up equals each are sold allows buying the parts to build 3 more.

    Dummy, I have no freaking clue as to what point you are attempting to make.

    The first 100 fund building the next 300.

    Huh, dummy?

    Too late there are more than 10 units sent out to different car reviewers.

    Ten you say dummy? I have only seen a white and black unit in review. Being the skeptical sort, that I am, a body swap could have been easily done, or perhaps a new paint job, to make it appear that they have more then one unit on the road. But maybe I am being a bit harsh, but then again dummy, you ARE stupid, ya know?

    If Jerry had ten units as you say, I am VERY certain that he would formally mention it, for instance dummy, look here:

    Unit #5 as reviewed by Car & Driver

    Those not use to-doing small batch under price so forcing them them to attempt to produce too many to break even. At 1000 units the solo cost of development and production will be for sure covered.

    Surely talking out your ass again dummy, as neither you “dummy” nor Robert would begin to know the break-even point for such. Unless you have been exposed to the books and finances, which of course you have not. Dummies can’t even count, let alone beginf to comprehend simple accounting practices.

    EPA LOL you kidding me Grece are you that dumb. EPA petrol cars have to deal with but not Electrics. There is another group you have to be certified with to put something on the road.

    NO you are dumb. All electric cars must be certified by the EPA and issued a certificate of conformity you dolt. Tesla did not do this years ago, and had to pay $275K in fines dummy.

    You actually contradicted yourself dummy, are you aware of this FACT? Obviously not, as you are dumb. http://mrpogson.com/2017/03/31/electra-meccanica-doesnt-just-build-cheap-cars/#comment-373655

    Electra Meccanica, no where to be found. Imagine my shock!

    Nissan is listed in the EPA database. Good luck finding Electra Meccanica..LOL.

    CHUCKLE…dummy

  67. oiaohm says:

    Grece those delivery quota numbers are normal. The thing you are not allowing on the the snowball effect. High mark-up equals each are sold allows buying the parts to build 3 more.

    The first 100 fund building the next 300.

    I bet they don’t even build ten units tops!
    Too late there are more than 10 units sent out to different car reviewers.

    Those not use to-doing small batch under price so forcing them them to attempt to produce too many to break even. At 1000 units the solo cost of development and production will be for sure covered.

    EPA LOL you kidding me Grece are you that dumb. EPA petrol cars have to deal with but not Electrics. There is another group you have to be certified with to put something on the road.

  68. DrLoser wrote, “Sell the SUV and buy a second-hand Nissan Leaf, goddamnit”.

    Go jump in the lake… TLW was out in the garage this morning, carefully washing the SUV’s rims. I don’t think she will agree to sell it, although, technically, I am the registered owner and if I really wanted to live dangerously… No. I’ll wait for my Solo so that I might loco-mote without fear.

  69. DrLoser says:

    It wasn’t broken when I made the comment. Perhaps it’s being refined.

    Get real, Robert. Stop acting like a La-La resident who is constitutionally opposed to opening his pocket-book, and stand up for yourself. You’re a solid citizen of Canada!

    “Refined” indeed. It ain’t gonna happen.

    Now, my advice to you is to admit that you don’t get transport for free, and accept that your wife’s choice of vehicle is despicable and contrary to all the things you claim to hold dear.

    Sell the SUV and buy a second-hand Nissan Leaf, goddamnit. Just for once in your life, sand up for what you claim to believe!

  70. Kurkosdr wrote, “Link is broken”.

    It wasn’t broken when I made the comment. Perhaps it’s being refined.

  71. Grece wrote, “where is the spare tire kept at? “.

    Where’s the spare for a ” Harley”. Some buyers suggest “spare in can”.

  72. Grece says:

    http://electrameccanica.com/ca/delivery-dates-ca/

    LOL… they are going to build 400 electric big-wheels in 2017? No way in hell that will be achieved, I bet they don’t even build ten units tops! To meet that quota, they need to be cracking out fifty per month, RIGHT NOW.

  73. Grece says:

    Hmmmmm…404 error…….See http://electrameccanica.com/desk-jerry-kroll-3/

    deliveries near Vancouver begin

    Oh? How many are they rolling out?

    the assembly line we were shown will produce 2-3 Solos a week and be replicated to scale up

    For reasons fore mentioned, that is rather dubious. Just who is going to replicate and scale up, when they are broke?

    certification should complete soon

    Certification by whom? The EPA?? I looked for the Electra Meccanica name in the EPA database and could not find any reference what so ever, so seems like Jerry is blowing smoke.

    One thing I like to know, where is the spare tire kept at? Those wimpy tires are going to flat in no time.

  74. kurkosdr says:

    There’s a new blog post today, From the Desk of Jerry Kroll
    – deliveries near Vancouver begin
    – the assembly line we were shown will produce 2-3 Solos a week and be replicated to scale up
    – certification should complete soon

    See http://electrameccanica.com/desk-jerry-kroll-3/

    Link is broken, last post on blog was on 29th of March, not today or yesterday.

  75. kurkosdr says:

    So, you are getting it in 11 years (assuming the promised 3 cars per month production rate by Jerry pans out and continues in the future).

    Even in your fictional 3 cars per week rate, you are not getting that car earlier than 3 years from now (which is pure fantasy, Jerry clearly said 3 cars per month, and I am sure he can hear his won words). Pog, you need better fantasies. Dreaming about a mobility scooter with a roof with a 11-year-from-now delivery date is just pathetic.

    Or, you can stop bragging about the green things you supposedly want to buy (emphasize supposedly), and either buy one available in the near-term future, or stop bragging. Let’s be honest, you are smart enough to not want to plop 11.000 American dollars on something like the Solo EV. The main advantage of the Solo EV (compared to the Leaf) is that the Solo is never going to ship, which means you can brag and brag about how much you want to buy it, without ever having to plop them money down to buy it.

  76. There’s a new blog post today, From the Desk of Jerry Kroll
    – deliveries near Vancouver begin
    – the assembly line we were shown will produce 2-3 Solos a week and be replicated to scale up
    – certification should complete soon

    See http://electrameccanica.com/desk-jerry-kroll-3/

  77. Kurkosdr wrote, ” in the best case scenario, you are number 801″.

    Q1 2018 shows 401-801, wherein lies my number, 801 is far worse than my number.

  78. Kurkosdr says:

    Mine is scheduled for Q1 2018. Unfortunately, there are hundreds booked ahead of me. Fortunately, they should have all the bugs removed by the time I get mine.

    So, in the best case scenario, you are number 801. Which means that in order for them to keep their Q1 date, aka 11 months from now, , they have to crank out 72 cars per month. Jerry has promised 3 cars per month, which means that 801/3= 267 months aka 22 years. Even if they increase production to 12 cars per month (aka if we assume Jerry can’t hear his own words and meant 3 cars per week and not 3 cars per month), you are looking at 801/12 = 66.75 months aka 5 and a half years. Good grief. You just funded the cars of the early birds with your deposit.

    BTW, since you are using the “scheduled for Q1 2018” promise as an honest-to-goodness calculation, let me point your eyes to the following text in the linked page:
    “*All delivery dates are subject to change without notice.”
    Which basically translates to “you ‘ve been played”.

  79. Kurkosdr wrote, “what is your number on the preorder waiting list Pog, and have you calculated the number of months you have to wait?”

    Mine is scheduled for Q1 2018. Unfortunately, there are hundreds booked ahead of me. Fortunately, they should have all the bugs removed by the time I get mine.

  80. kurkosdr says:

    That’s the expected delivery date of new orders placed today

    Because at the breakneck production pace of 3 cars a month, all existing orders will be fulfilled on or before Q1 2018, right? Again, what is your number on the preorder waiting list Pog, and have you calculated the number of months you have to wait?

  81. Grece wrote, “You can get a one year old Leaf for half the cost and get four times as many seats”.

    No, you can’t. Four year old Leafs go for more than the price of a Solo. A new Leaf is twice the price. A Leaf was on my wish list back in the day when TLW was shopping for a car. She bought our Lexus used but in good condition. I also had VW diesel in the list.

    I don’t need four seats. I don’t want four seats. I don’t want the inefficiency four seats causes.

    If that sound is noise from gears, it will likely reduce after a break-in period.

  82. Grece, quoting a news item: “So delivery is pushed back to Q1 2018 now, this must truly boggle Robert.”

    That’s the expected delivery date of new orders placed today, not the start of delivery which is expected this month. We already know the name of the first buyer, Greens and Beans deli.

  83. oiaohm says:

    Grece and that abstract is from a youtube video of a reviewer driving a solo and talking at the same time with the background road noise then expanded by artistic license by a person at CNET who has never driven one. Compared EV a solo is noisy compared to something with a petrol/diesel engine the cabin noise is not that loud.
    https://www.youtube.com/embed/zanP0UINxe0

    I would not call Solo EV quite I would not call it that loud that you can not talk to someone on a phone.

    Having zero safety features because it doesn’t legally need them?
    Not exactly true about zero.
    https://sites.google.com/site/uavjw861/collapsible-steering-columns/how-does-a-collapsible-steering-column-work

    Basics like collapsible steering column is included.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GEfTlti1OM

    Also watch the video carefully. Note that the material that the chassis is made from is stronger than steel. The crush zones are aluminium and replaceable. The core chassis in the solo is not only light but its also insanely strong. Reality is another car on the road hitting the solo is most likely going to push the solo out way.

    Also I would not want to rear end a solo. That strong sheet stick out back is going to quite a number on what ever hit it.

    You don’t see airbags in race cars. Solo is to race car specifications for safety. Solo design I would think a 5 point race driver seat would make more sense than air-bags.

    Please remember limited space explosive charge of airbags can kind of kill you. So the solo not having airbags could design sanity. I do question the seat belt style in the solo. 5 or 4 point I think should be it seat belts.

    So noisy you can’t talk on the phone or listen to music is crazy in a modern car.
    Remember there is a downside to sound proofing as well so a Solo you are going to hear emergency vehicles due to low sound proofing.

  84. Grece says:

    Seems Jerry likes to run, but this doesn’t trickle down to running a business.

    Greens – Jerry Kroll: CEO of Electra Meccanica, which is producing a one-person electric car and is supposed to hit the market early in 2018. Kroll is a marathoner, with 40 races to his name.

    http://globalnews.ca/news/3383769/b-c-election-2017-vancouver-mount-pleasant-riding/

    So delivery is pushed back to Q1 2018 now, this must truly boggle Robert.

  85. Grece says:

    Continuing the saga, I ran across this tidbit.

    “There’s a lot of mechanical whine from the electric motor and its single-speed reduction gear, as well as a good deal of road noise coming up from below the poorly insulated, lightweight composite cabin. Were there actually room for a second soul aboard, you’d have to shout to talk to them.”

    Points to consider:

    What’s the point of an EV that’s noisy ? So noisy you can’t talk on the phone or listen to music is crazy in a modern car.

    Having zero safety features because it doesn’t legally need them?

    You can get a one year old Leaf for half the cost and get four times as many seats, with real EV quietness and safety.

  86. The Wiz wrote, “the major attraction of this vehicle to be to Robert Pogson is that, if it is really produced, it will become the cheapest EV on the market”.

    I don’t even know whether that’s true. I think Solo is somewhat overpriced but I don’t care. I think it is sufficient a car for my needs and certainly more efficient than other popular models. There’s no denying the low drag of a narrow car with a boat tailed shape. Most motorcycles are less efficient either because of jagged shape or a gasoline engine and Solo is easier to ride.

  87. Wizard Emeritus says:

    I am sure that we can all agree that the major attraction of this vehicle to be to Robert Pogson is that, if it is really produced, it will become the cheapest EV on the market.

    That is, of course, if it does not become the latest of his el-cheapo dreams that does not pan out.

  88. Kurkosdr says:

    Who buys a Lexus anyway? It’s a car brand that is as expensive as a BMW, if not more, without any of the style and looks. But hey, it is Japanese, so North Americans think it farts rainbows

  89. Grece wrote, “What monopoly?”

    The part is “proprietary”. Lexus is the exclusive supplier and they can charge whatever they want. If you want the wheel to spin, you have to pay it. I’ve changed a lot of wheel bearings. Many are industry standard parts, not Lexus. I think the Hyundai cost about $40/wheel: seal + inner/outer races and bearings. It took about 30 minutes/wheel.

  90. Grece says:

    The Lexus is a very expensive car. e.g. a front wheel bearing which should cost ~$100 cost $370 and installation a similar amount.

    OEM bearing’s should only cost $50, and YOU should be able to install it yourself.

    This what monopoly does.

    What monopoly? Seems to me you don’t know how to fix a car.

    In the past year we’ve had electrical, Bering’s and brake work with no end in sight. We’ve postponed $thousands of less urgent repairs.

    Well, thousands is less then fifteen thousands is it not? You made it sound like you spent $15K on repairs, when in fact its only typical car repair which is normal. Exaggerate much?

    The engine and hybrid battery are also aged. I don’t think she’s taken more than one trip over 100 miles in the past years. She uses an SUV to commute 15 miles.

    I make 5-15 mile trips with my Ford 7.3 all the time, and I bet my truck is far older than your hybrid.

    Two Solos would be less trouble.

    Well, ahem… that’s pure fantasy isn’t it? Everyone knows that you will never get an electrical Solo in the next five-years.

  91. Grece wrote, “>$15K in repairs, for what!? Did one of you blow-up an engine??”

    The Lexus is a very expensive car. e.g. a front wheel bearing which should cost ~$100 cost $370 and installation a similar amount. This is what monopoly does. In the past year we’ve had electrical, bearings and brake work with no end in sight. We’ve postponed $thousands of less urgent repairs. The engine and hybrid battery are also aged. I don’t think she’s taken more than one trip over 100 miles in the past years. She uses an SUV to commute 15 miles. Two Solos would be less trouble.

  92. Grece says:

    It’s guaranteed, that Pog won’t be receiving a Solo anytime in the foreseeable future. I would go with the Nissan Leaf, if electric cars where my thing.

    I see repairs on the Lexus costing more than the purchase price of the Solo.

    >$15K in repairs, for what!? Did one of you blow-up an engine??

  93. Kurkosdr says:

    For eff’s sake Pog, there is no Solo for you for years, stop comparing against a non-existent option.

  94. Kurkosdr wrote, “You don’t really want to spend on an electric car for the next 4 years or so, because your existing vehicle will be perfectly serviceable during those years and it is something that has already been paid for.”

    That’s pretty close to TLW’s view, not mine. I see repairs on the Lexus costing more than the purchase price of the Solo. She’s pretty sharp at real estate, not machines.

  95. Kurkosdr says:

    Clarification:3 people at a time = 3 people at a time per month

  96. Kurkosdr says:

    1) You can buy a used Nissan Leaf for the price of the Solo, and it will still be better quality than whatever Jerry will put together in his Custom Body Shop

    2) The Nissan Leaf might be heavier, but you can actually have it now instead of waiting for everybody else in front of you in the pre-order queue to get theirs, 3 people at a time.

    Admit it Pog. You don’t really want to spend on an electric car for the next 4 years or so, because your existing vehicle will be perfectly serviceable during those years and it is something that has already been paid for.

  97. Kurkosdr wrote, “why not buy a Nissan Leaf right now?”

    A new Leaf is much more expensive ($34K versus $20K CDN) and much less efficient. 24 KWH of Leaf gets one 97 miles of range at 50 mph. Solo should do that with 16.1 KWH. The weight of the Leaf is triple the weight of the Solo but that’s not the main factor affecting range at constant speed on level ground. Cross-sectional area is. Leaf is about double the area of Solo. Further, I don’t need such a large vehicle 98% of the time and I expect Solo should be easier to drive: better view, less weight to manoeuvre, lower centre of gravity, and easier to clean/wax/change tires.

  98. Kurkosdr says:

    you unless = unless you

  99. Kurkosdr says:

    So, assuming you do want an electric car, why not buy a Nissan Leaf right now? After the 3-vehicles-per-month news, do you really need any other news to abandon the Solo EV idea and look at some other EV supplier? What is your number on the waiting list anyway? (protip: you can calculate the number of months you will have to wait by dividing that number by 3, or even 4 if you want)

    Unless of course you are quite happy with your current vehicle and don’t really feel like spending a ton of money to buy an electric car, much like Beast is always about to get replaced with some ARM board but never actually is. Aka, you unless like to boast how you are going to go fully “green” and “open” in the near future, but you are actually quite happy with your current equipment which is familiar, does the job alright and has already being paid for, and don’t really intend to replace your existing equipment. In that case, picking an EV supplier like ElectraMeccanica that is going to deliver your vehicle one financial quarter after fusion becomes a viable power source is a neat strategy. But only in that case…

  100. Kurkosdr wrote, “start parking those $200 aside every month anyways”.

    I have the cash on hand any time I want to make a withdrawal from one of my pension funds, but I could also get a loan to spread out the capital cost over a few years. The choice depends on how my income increases, not on how I save my pennies.

  101. oiaohm says:

    Grece
    Why does Jerry want people to sign a NDA? It’s not like anything he has done couldn’t be replicated or patented, its all very generic.
    There is thing to that flat sheet chassis construction we have not seen. Also with first to file rules on patents you use a NDA so other parties who you are sharing with first cannot claim association and beat you to punch patenting your own inventions.

    3 per month does not line up with the test production run of 10 being complete in under a month. By the mark up on the solo the break even point looks to be about 500 units. Also if you read the blog they are expecting todo 500 by mid next year.

    Of course 3 per month could line up for a while depending on how many racing models have been order that have to be produced to take part in competition. Solo R class. So you have the Solo and Solo R coming from the same factory what one has build dominance. Solo R having build dominance would see Solo normal have a low build rate.

  102. Kurkosdr says:

    We’ve seen the facility. If they were going to produce only two or three a month, they could do it in someone’s backyard. That layout is set for parallel processing, not frequent coffee breaks. We saw an inventory of parts, enough to generate tens of $thousands of margin. OTOH K is blowing smoke/farts/hot air.

    Yeah, I am sure you know the condition of Jerry’s assembly line better than Jerry (note second virtual pat on the back). And I am sure he meant “weeks” and can’t hear his own words, so when he said “month s” he didn’t feel the need to correct it.

    Also, seeing some parts in a building doesn’t mean seeing a functional assembly line, just like looking at some parts in an engine bay doesn’t mean seeing a functional engine.

    Anyway, don’t reclaim the deposit if you feel so sure, but start parking those $200 aside every month anyways and give Jerry two years. After all, you need to pay for your Solo anyways (note virtual condescending look) Let’s see how this works out and who of us was right.

  103. Kurkosdr wrote, “by this time next year, EM will have produced 2-3 dozen”.

    That’s not reasonable. We’ve seen the facility. If they were going to produce only two or three a month, they could do it in someone’s backyard. That layout is set for parallel processing, not frequent coffee breaks. We saw an inventory of parts, enough to generate tens of $thousands of margin. OTOH K is blowing smoke/farts/hot air.

  104. Kurkosdr says:

    production will be “2 or 3 a month” locally

    Bahahaha *snort* *snort* This is so goddamn pathetic.

    So, by this time next year, EM will have produced 2-3 dozen vehicles for the early birds. In 2 years from now, they will have produced 64 whole vehicles (best case scenario). To be honest, I expected them to deliver an initial batch of a couple dozen vehicles or so in May and then continue with a half a dozen per month or so, before they eventually run out of parts or money. Reality is worse than I could ever imagine. What is your number on the waiting list Pog? A hundred?

    (I’m hoping this is a mistake and it’s really 2 or 3 a week…)

    Yeah, I am pretty sure Jerry cannot hear his own words, so when he accidentally said “months”, he didn’t feel the need to correct it to “weeks” immediately to avoid giving any wrong impressions from his tiny verbal slip (note the virtual patting on the arm).

    Look buddy, you ‘ve been played. It happens. Those EM guys might have a rudimentary assembly line, but they don’t have the parts and possibly the manpower to run it. Aka, they have no ability to mass produce, as the best case scenario of 3 vehicles per month demonstrates. The best thing you can do right now is try to find out how much of the preorder money is recoverable (if any) and start saving for a used Nissan Leaf. All you have to do is park aside 200 dollars a month, each month. In 2 years from now, you will have saved enough money to buy an electric car which has been made from a major automaker, meets the reliability and quality standards of a major automaker, seats 4 and has a bigger boot (that’s how I am supposed to call it here in England) and has an extensive dealership network for support (all comparisons made against the Solo EV). And you actually get to have it in 2 years, guaranteed, but if your Solo waiting list number is greater than 64 you are guaranteed to NOT have it in 2 years. But I guess Jerry will go to Dragon’s Den and secure a windfall of millions, and then a proper assembly line will materialise or something (btw I wouldn’t be surprised if the 3 vehicles per month target is dependent on how Dragon’s Den goes, at least for the long term).

    PS: Do you know how I knew those guys were phonies? Let me give you a hint: In their InterMechannica page, you will see they advertise they sell custom bodies which are Porsche replicas. So far so good. Do they advertise an estimated shipping date? Do they advertise a price? Of course not, all their stuff is handmade stuff made at extremely limited volumes for an undisclosed price. And you think those guys can mass produce just because they can hammer a faux-porsche body when give a ton of time.

  105. Grece wroge, “This presentation was setup by a few Greenies to cram an agenda down young people’s minds on May-Day, namely Communism”

    Nope. Go crawl back into your grave, McCarthy. The only mention of politics was a mention of the oil lobby. 98% of the presentation was about living electrically renewably.

  106. Grece says:

    Jerry Kroll, CEO of EM, gave an inspiring presentation

    Inspiring? Jerry’s speech was NOT inspiring, no one in the room was engaged at all. They were all busy looking down at their smartphones.

    This presentation was setup by a few Greenies to cram an agenda down young people’s minds on May-Day, namely Communism, which coincidentally aligns with your hypocritical socialist ideals. The moment someone says something you do not like, you ban or tell them to shut-up or crawl back into their hole.

    http://canadafreepress.com/article/may-day-is-a-march-for-communism

  107. Grece, circling the drain, wrote, “Why does Jerry want people to sign a NDA? “.

    It’s an NDA between EMV and Dragons’ Den. DD wants ratings so Jerry can’t tell us how it turns out until broadcast…

    Further, Tesla is not a competitor. T can transport kids. The restaurant was the first to reserve a Solo. Watch the video to learn all these things. The shop can easily ship 3 a week. When they go into production they can add staff if needed paying them from the proceeds.

  108. Grece says:

    Those kids are about as engaged as a autistic person during his speech. One of the questions posed was if anyone had rode in a electric car, and to Jerry’s surprise, no one had, so his recommendation is to go have your parents take you to a Tesla dealer and go for a ride. WOW.. nothing like diluting your brand.

    If the first delivery is to a restaurant, were they a paying customer or is it just more promotional advertising?

    Production of 2-3 a month would be correct for such a small garage and very few staff with little funds.

    Why does Jerry want people to sign a NDA? It’s not like anything he has done couldn’t be replicated or patented, its all very generic. Besides, Tesla has beat him to the market and he is a late-comer.

    Crash-tested by whom?

    Please tell us the name of this Chinese partner.

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