It’s On! Lemaker Cello To Be Available In Time For Christmas.

“LEMAKER SALES 22:30 (2 minutes ago)
 
to me
 
We will kick off the Cello production at the middle of Decemeber.”
 
e-mail from Lemaker in response to my query (“We’ve been waiting many months for the long-ago announced Cello. Is it ever going to happen?”)
Wow! It’s finally happening. Too bad I’ve depleted my annuity for this month buying hardware for my alternator and peanut butter and jam… I may not have the cash to buy a Cello until January but I think it’s worth the wait.

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
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104 Responses to It’s On! Lemaker Cello To Be Available In Time For Christmas.

  1. DrLoser wrote, “interestingly enough, even as an incompetent maniac, you haven’t bought one as a replacement for Beast.
     
    Heaven only knows why.”

    Odroid-C2 is limited to 2gB RAM. That’s not enough to run my software without swapping. Also, Odroid-C2 has a very tiny cache limiting throughput. So, it’s the client machine around here. The Cello or this Armada 8040 Community Board will be the server. I can plug 16-32gB ECC DDR4 RAM in the Armada 8040, allowing service from RAM for most things, and providing more connectivity, storage and CPU power. I should be in a position to place an order in January 2017, just next month.

  2. DrLoser says:

    Take Odroid-C2, for instance. It can serve stuff. Costs ~$100.

    Define “stuff,” Robert. Explain the scalable properties of that “stuff.”

    Only an incompetent maniac would consider the Odroid-C2 to be a server, Robert.

    You are that incompetent maniac. And interestingly enough, even as an incompetent maniac, you haven’t bought one as a replacement for Beast.

    Heaven only knows why.

  3. DrLoser says:

    You may be looking at real code writing exercises to get you investment to work at all.

    No problem. For an extra $1000, I can write Robert a cross-compiler from Pascal to C, with the relevant bindings to the driver libraries.

    Hey, what can I say? I come cheap.

    But not cheap enough for the Miser of Manitoba.

  4. dougman says:

    Meanwhile, the rest of the world is ordering Intel server boards and building quantities that will fill data-centers with product.

  5. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Fortunately, “few” is enough for me. I don’t require the world to rush to ARMs”

    Actually, you DO require that the world of the ARM board manufacturers see enough demand to produce a low cost ARM development board with enough storage and network connectivity to replace the now ancient piece of crap that you call a “server”.

    So far you haven’t done too well Robert Pogson. After over 1 year Lemaker has only been able to promise to release a product that is broken real soon now. The vendor that you are currently pinning your hopes on, SolidRun, is only taking “pre-orders” what they are calling an “evaluation kit”. I hope that you know that Evaluation kits like this are generally not production products and can change on their way to becoming production shipping product. I also hope that you noticed that this board is really a specialty board that is aimed at the developers of networking appliance products. Adapting it as your next server platform may turn out to be a bit more work that you think. You may be looking at real code writing exercises to get you investment to work at all.

    Its going to be interesting to watch.

  6. The Wiz wrote, “there are few if any companies offering ARM based products that can function as an inexpensive desktop class systems with expansion capability that he can press into service as his “server”.”

    That is the only true point made by several detractors here. Fortunately, “few” is enough for me. I don’t require the world to rush to ARMs. They are way ahead of me on clients. ARM certainly can do what I and Beast do in IT.

  7. Deaf Spy says:

    Dear, dear, I am running SQL Server 2016 on a virtual machine on my desktop.

    Robert, is my desktop a server? Or is my desktop a server, hosting a server as a service that hosts another server as a service? Or is my desktop a client that consumes a service provided by a server, hosted on a virtual machine, hosted on my desktop? Or is it both? My head starts hurting…

  8. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Take Odroid-C2, for instance. It can serve stuff. Costs ~$100.”

    The fact that you can shoehorn a server class OS on top of what is nothing more than a developer board for embedded systems does not make it a “server” for anyone for but you.

    Any more that my running of Windows server 2003 EE on a Dell Inspiron 9200 portable certified for windows XP some 12 years ago made that hardware configuration a “server”.

  9. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “then you are, I am afraid, a total imbecile.”

    More likely Robert Pogson is still living in the days when a server was little more than a desktop turned on its side. OF course that hasn’t been true for over 20 years, but stubborn holdouts like Robert Pogson still think that the fact that they can run a server class OS on a desktop makes their system a “server” in the modern sense – it doesn’t.

    But the real problem for Robert Pogson is that there are few if any companies offering ARM based products that can function as an inexpensive desktop class systems with expansion capability that he can press into service as his “server”.
    IN short Robert Pogson wants to have his cake , by abandoning x86-64 for ARM, and eat it, by having ARM based hardware as cheap as the x86-64 hardware he used as his “server”.

    Perhaps the Israelis, will come through for him. I for one will sit back and watch the show.

  10. DrLoser wrote, “if you think a single one of these will come in at anything less than around $1000”.

    Take Odroid-C2, for instance. It can serve stuff. Costs ~$100.

    I’ve used a ~$100 thin client as a print server and an Xserver, of course. You do know that servers provide services like that, eh?

  11. dougman says:

    I have to agree with Loser on this one, having built numerous servers for customers and myself. If Robert is calling a $100 box, a server then frankly he is a moron. All told, my NAS once populated with drives and such ran be a good $1000, probably more then that. 4TB drives a few years ago were pricey, now they have 8TB drives along with 4TB SSD’s.

  12. DrLoser says:

    Servers come in all shapes and sizes. Some are as little as $100 …

    Not right now, Robert. You can pick a Windows server. You can pick a Linux server. You can pick a LAMP server. You can pick an Office server. You can pick an Intel server. You can pick an ARM server. You can pick an ISP server (pick ISP of choice), you can pick a Cloud server, you can pick an in-house server.

    But if you think a single one of these will come in at anything less than around $1000 — and even that is a stretch — then you are, I am afraid, a total imbecile.

  13. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “I thought this was an interactive play of sorts, whereby we can toss tomatoes at the stage performer for such a lousy performance.”

    Sometimes delayed gratification can be more satisfying, Dougie.

  14. dougman says:

    “I recommend that you just shut up, sit back, and watch the show…”

    I thought this was an interactive play of sorts, whereby we can toss tomatoes at the stage performer for such a lousy performance.

  15. The Wiz wrote, “it also costs like a real server class product should.”

    Servers come in all shapes and sizes. Some are as little as $100 and others are $100K. Any ordinary PC can serve as a server. M$’s bastardized file/print system makes every PC a server for good or ill. There is no tightly defined “server class”. There are big servers and little servers depending on connectivity, power and resources. My needs are for a minimal server with resources a little better than the typical desktop. That’s all.

  16. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Here is something you can purchase now: Gigabyte MP30-AR0”

    This has already been pointed out to Robert Pogson, Dougie. Unfortunately it also costs like a real server class product should.

    I recommend that you just shut up, sit back, and watch the show…

  17. dougman says:

    PreOrder: $349.00–$419.00

    LOL….otherwise known as a SCAM.

    Here is something you can purchase now: Gigabyte MP30-AR0

  18. Wizard Emeritus says:

    ” It certainly covers several of the deficiencies of Cello and it’s not from Intel.”

    Indeed it looks like you may be fortunate – Assuming of course it actually ships.

  19. Deaf Spy wrote, “Another board, designed for a totally different purpose…”

    Let’s see… ” Linux LTS kernel 4.4.x, mainline Linux, Yocto 2.1 and netmap , the ARMADA 8040 Networking Community board is an optimal platform that community developers and Independent Software Vendors (ISVs) can use for development around ODP and OFP and for delivering ARM based VNFs.”

    It runs mainline Linux, has great networking and meets most of my requirements nicely and you’re concerned it won’t work for me? It has an A-72 core or two and a reasonably sized cache and DDR4 RAM with EDAC and SATA. What can’t I do with it that Beast does now? It certainly covers several of the deficiencies of Cello and it’s not from Intel.

  20. Deaf Spy says:

    It seems ARMADA 8040 Community Board

    Another board, designed for a totally different purpose… Go, Robert, buy it! Don’t spoil the fun for us! 🙂

  21. doug,man says:

    “Egyptians are Arabs…”

    Silly man, Egyptians didn’t speak Arabic; they spoke their own language, attested in hieroglyphics.

    So using your analogy. Indians are Americans, and Eskimo’s are Canadians?

  22. dougman, showing his ignorance, wrote, “The Greeks, Indians and the Egyptians contributed far more mathematics then what Arabs ever came to know”.

    Egyptians are Arabs…

  23. dougman says:

    “Arabs contributed greatly to mathematics in the early days”

    LMAO…come now. The Greeks, Indians and the Egyptians contributed far more mathematics then what Arabs ever came to know.

  24. dougman says:

    “I’ve lived among the Arabs and they make wonderful stuff: rugs, wonderful fruit like dates, apricots, and other veggies.”

    But NOT server boards, something I doubt you will ever find.

  25. dougman says:

    “Currently, Saudi Arabia is training a whole generation to be self-sufficient in goods, services and technology by investing wisely a lot of their oil-revenue.”

    LOL… sans oil revenue, SA would be a pile of camel dung in the sand. By the way, Saudi’s are know to deport illegal foreign workers, I wonder why that is? According to you, that’s just wrong. Perhaps you should write King Salman and tell him he is a xenophobe.

  26. dougman says:

    “Bigot!”

    Hmmm, a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions.

    Same thing could be said about you regarding Trump, free-trade, Linux, Windows, Microsoft and entire litany of idiotic beliefs you hold so dear. Namely, the crème de la crème is this notion of Global Warming and that CO2 is a pollutant topics.

  27. dougman, the bigot wrote, “Arabs don’t make anything useful”.

    Bigot! I’ve lived among the Arabs and they make wonderful stuff: rugs, wonderful fruit like dates, apricots, and other veggies they grow in the desert by irrigation and recycling, and they were making most of their radio-pharmaceuticals in Riyadh when I was there. Arabs contributed greatly to mathematics in the early days ISTR, while dougman’s ancestors were going without soap and killing each other en masse in gruesome ways. Currently, Saudi Arabia is training a whole generation to be self-sufficient in goods, services and technology by investing wisely a lot of their oil-revenue. I think if Iran and Trump keep on a collision-heading the Saudis could make their own bomb in-house in 3-5 years. They have superior technology and funds compared to what Manhattan Project had. Not that nukes are particularly useful but when surrounded by idiots, it’s wise not to bring a knife to a gunfight. Arabs can do whatever they want. They are capable, motivated and resourceful. They had to be that way to survive in deserts where others feared to tread.

    dougman also wrote, “I DARE YOU, to find any server motherboard from a Muslim country.”

    That’s pretty easy. Just look at Indonesia or Pakistan or India or Singapore or Malaysia

  28. dougman says:

    Already dropping the idea of using the Cello? LOL…good!, as you should.

    “I also don’t like that it’s a product of Israel, a country with which I disagree on politics considerably.”

    Why don’t you buy a board from Iran or Palestine then. Oh wait, Arabs don’t make anything useful, that’s right.

    Israeli GDP surpasses Saudi Arabia, imagine that. The Jew scientists can out innovate any of the other Muslim nations and to think you hate them for that? LOL…

    I DARE YOU, to find any server motherboard from a Muslim country.

  29. It seems ARMADA 8040 Community Board will ship to early-adopters this month and to the rest of the world in January 2017. It’s superior to Lemaker Cello in several ways: DDR4, Cortex A-72 CPU and abundant networking connections. Unfortunately, it has only one DIMM slot and I don’t really need 10gb Ethernet and a slightly higher price but it is acceptable. I guess 10gb Ethernet could be a future upgrade…

    I also don’t like that it’s a product of Israel, a country with which I disagree on politics considerably. When I was young, I was raised on stories of gung-ho! survival against the odds but now I’ve read more history and agree the Arabs were severely harmed by “the creation of Israel”. It doesn’t help that Israel occupies
    the West Bank, has sent assassination squads all over the world, and generally has been a bad neighbour whether it’s a matter of invasion, bombardment by air, sea or land, espionage, nuclear threats, etc…. That probably was a major causation of much of today’s terrorism. Today, I’m just tired of all that and hope a newer generation will find a way to bury the old guys and find a new way…

    So, this has the inside track at the moment for my renewal of IT here.

  30. dougman says:

    “I can restore from local backup and I have lots of current data that I can restore from local backup.”

    Where do you store your DWM backups? I am slowly in the process of finishing my 40×40 pole barn, my 2nd NAS will be resident there and mirror the one in my basement or vice versa. So that gives me redundant data.

    “ganging up 4 of his el-cheapo 1TB drives in RAID 0+1 (striped then mirrored)”

    RAID is not a backup. With my current setup, I can achieve up to 60TB and I about a third of the way there. I don’t do RAID anymore, it’s far simpler to use a single parity drive versus spreading it over the array. Dual parity just became available, so now if so unlucky I can handle two drives taking a dump.

  31. The Wiz wrote, “Robert Pogson has already all but stated that he doesn’t have any data that he cares about.”

    That’s not true. I have lots of old archival data I can restore from local backup and I have lots of current data that I can restore from local backup. I don’t need to do it instantly from a mirror. I do need speed in daily usage however.

  32. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “RAID 0? wait till a drive craps out on you.”

    Dougie, Robert Pogson has already all but stated that he doesn’t have any data that he cares about. And being ultra cheap, he wont even consider ganging up 4 of his el-cheapo 1TB drives in RAID 0+1 (striped then mirrored).

    Of course the rest of us who actually have data that we value can only shake our heads.

  33. dougman says:

    RAID 0? wait till a drive craps out on you.

  34. dougman, pissing again, wrote, “In your case, your disk is SLOW.”

    The discs are on Beast and they are decent, 1TB.
    hdparm -tT /dev/sdh1

    /dev/sdh1:
    Timing cached reads: 3214 MB in 2.00 seconds = 1606.80 MB/sec
    Timing buffered disk reads: 594 MB in 3.00 seconds = 197.74 MB/sec

    I don’t need anything faster for gigabit NFS, but if I wanted fast, I would use the RAID 0 array:
    hdparm -tT /dev/md4

    /dev/md4:
    Timing cached reads: 3210 MB in 2.00 seconds = 1604.94 MB/sec
    Timing buffered disk reads: 1246 MB in 3.00 seconds = 414.90 MB/sec

  35. kurkosdr boldly wrote, “Unless you want to run Android, there is nothing for you in the ARM world. This is one of the reasons the industry is not even evaluating the feasibility of ARM microservers despite ARM’s claims of high performance in the near future”.

    ARM64 is in the mainline kernel. Why shouldn’t it be? The devices are mostly the same chips as found on x86, just hooked up to different buses. The IoT and DIY people may not be interested in long term support for Linux on these SoCs but in servers and routers people do care that software be updated. It’s happening.

    See, for instance in linux-4.4$ ls arch/arm64/boot/dts/
    altera apm broadcom exynos hisilicon Makefile mediatek rockchip xilinx
    amd arm cavium freescale include marvell qcom sprd
    and
    ls arch/arm64/boot/dts/rockchip
    Makefile rk3368.dtsi rk3368-r88.dts

    Similarly, drivers for Cavium systems are already in the kernel and the Cello uses many of the same devices.

  36. kurkosdr says:

    As I said, better hope that the Cello Board works for you…

    I never understood Pog’s obsession with ARM. ARM SoC vendors are your typical “embedded” SoC vendor where everything revolves around Board Support Packages containing drivers which are meant to work with one version of the kernel and one version of Android and everything else is pure experimentation (“this works, this doesn’t”). Yet there is always the occasional loon who wants to run GNU/Linux on the damn thing.

    Earth to loons: Unless you want to run Android, there is nothing for you in the ARM world. This is one of the reasons the industry is not even evaluating the feasibility of ARM microservers despite ARM’s claims of high performance in the near future (RealSoonNow(tm)), because no matter what happens on the performance front, the rate at which ARM SoC vendor discontinue support for drivers/BSPs makes the whole idea of ARM on servers moot. Will your Cello even work with full drivers when you buy it?

    Meanwhile, Intel supports Linux and GNU/Linux with regular driver releases, but they are not Gluten-free or Free-range or NonEvil-empire enough for Pog.

    Seriously Pog, you are one step away from Stallmanness, complaining about proprietary BIOSes and conveniently ignoring that PC monitors already have more complex software in them than the BIOS, and so is your microwave.

  37. dougman says:

    “dd if=/home/alicia/Videos/House_of_Horrors.mp4 of=/dev/null bs=1024k”

    You did not send it anywhere…LOL. /dev/null is a good destination for testing/timing read operations that’s it. In your case, your disk is SLOW. Get a SSD.

    dd if=LA.Confidential.1997.1080p.BluRay.H264.AAC-RARBG.mp4 of=/dev/null bs=1024k
    2693+1 records in
    2693+1 records out
    2823965801 bytes (2.8 GB) copied, 5.47945s, 511 MB/s

  38. dougman, pissing, wrote, “dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd”

    Oh, well. I can piss too:
    dd if=/home/alicia/Videos/House_of_Horrors.mp4 of=/dev/null bs=1024k
    1000+0 records in
    1000+0 records out
    1048576000 bytes (1.0 GB) copied, 8.94785 s, 117 MB/s

    That’s over gigabit/s NFS from Beast to Odroid-C2. It doesn’t get much better than that.

  39. dougman says:

    “Strange, my Odroid-C2 can do better over NFS…”

    Well, the 80MB/s was a LOW average. But since you feel like having a pissing contest.

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.0468524 s, 89.5 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.0523001 s, 90.2 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.0447639 s, 93.7 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.051587 s, 91.3 MB/s
    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.0502282 s, 93.5 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.0444891 s, 94.3 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=8192
    8192+0 records in
    8192+0 records out
    4194304 bytes (4.2 MB, 4.0 MiB) copied, 0.0446856 s, 93.9 MB/s

    Simple math gives me an average of 92.3MB/s. Now lets do some longer tests and see where I end up.

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=500000
    500000+0 records in
    500000+0 records out
    256000000 bytes (256 MB, 244 MiB) copied, 2.66312 s, 96.1 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=500000
    500000+0 records in
    500000+0 records out
    256000000 bytes (256 MB, 244 MiB) copied, 2.66455 s, 96.1 MB/s

    ~ $ dd if=/dev/zero of=/mnt/Doug/test.dd count=100000000
    100000000+0 records in
    100000000+0 records out
    51200000000 bytes (51 GB, 48 GiB) copied, 478.413 s, 107 MB/s

    CHUCKLE

  40. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “But of course, Chrome OS is GNU/Linux basically.”

    Thats nice, but it doesn’t help you if the Chromebooks are being built with low power intel processors instead of your beloved ARM SOC’s. This would seem to make the Chromebook useless as a beast substitute.

    As I said, better hope that the Cello Board works for you…

  41. The Wiz wrote, “none of the Chromebooks are supported running linux, you get to follow third party instructions to do the deed”.

    But of course, Chrome OS is GNU/Linux basically. If one can write the storage there isn’t any problem adding software. Linux is FLOSS so the source code is available. So’s the rest of GNU so it can always be ported to a ChromeBook unless there is some nasty write-protection or signage.

  42. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Nonsense, many ARMed ChromeBooks do make nice desktop PCs. They can add extensive storage via USB or Ethernet.”

    Will they now? lets look at one survey of the top Chromebooks of 2016.

    http://topreviews.best/main-review/best-chromebooks?gclid=COjH1_Wy2NACFY9XDQodhvwMNA

    How interesting, only 2 of the 5 use ARM, the remainder of the “Best” chromebooks use, oops, Intel… thats a bummer.

    USB connectivity when present is USB 2.0. which is perfectly fine for single user use under ChromeOS, but less than wonderful when being hacked into a linux Server. also a bummer.

    Last but not least, none of the Chromebooks are supported running linux, you get to follow third party instructions to do the deed

    http://www.pcworld.com/article/2984834/chromebooks/installing-linux-on-a-chromebook-what-you-need-to-know.html

    Interestingly enough, it will probably work cleaner than the nonsense that you are probably going to have to go through with the Lemaker board. Still a bummer.

    One bit of good news, several chromebooks have micro HDMI ports on them, so you monitor problem no longer exists, at least for those chromebooks that run ARM instead of intel.

    Its all good.

  43. Deaf Spy says:

    Nonsense, many ARMed ChromeBooks do make nice desktop PCs

    Actually, ChromeBooks do make nice thin-clients / semi-thin clients (considering that extensive JS logic in a browser is already thick-client pattern). Multi-tasking with several background tasks? Not at all.

  44. dougman wrote, “are you blind?”

    Nope, but I am quite near-sighted and do much better with a large screen. In particular, my eyeglasses are optimized for distance and a larger screen helps a lot. My usual monitor is 20″ and others are 24-54 inches. I have to close one eye and remove my glasses to use tiny screens. 14/15″ I could use but it’s a step back. A notebook PC is not optimal for me. I think the few times I’ve used one I had a desktop monitor connected to escape the notebook’s limitations.

  45. dougman wrote, “Your cable modem handles DHCP and routing just fine, but no, lets do it the Pogson hard way.”

    For IP-addresses, sure, but I also set up TFTP for booting over the LAN. My present router and the cable modem don’t allow that. GNU/Linux is not hard. It’s easy. I think the only hard part of it is setting up a reliable firewall. My present kernel was not intended to be a firewall so the networking has to be reconfigured. Otherwise, it’s trivial to set up DHCP on any GNU/Linux computer. Interestingly, systemd does fight with my present configuration of the firewall… That’s one more level of complexity.

    dougman wrote, “Server? What a laugh!! I can get 80MB/s over NFS. I bet you you won’t see 250KB/sec throughput.”

    Strange, my Odroid-C2 can do better over NFS…
    dd if=/home/alicia/Videos/Family_videos/Christmas\ -\ 2010/MOV0D5.MOD of=/dev/null bs=1024k
    211+1 records in
    211+1 records out
    221487104 bytes (221 MB) copied, 2.731 s, 81.1 MB/s
    dd if=/home/alicia/Videos/Family_videos/Christmas\ -\ 2010/MOV0D4.MOD of=/dev/null bs=1024k
    254+1 records in
    254+1 records out
    266987520 bytes (267 MB) copied, 3.00423 s, 88.9 MB/s

  46. The Wiz wrote, ““everywhere” does not include systems capable of functioning as fully capable personal desktop computers.”

    Nonsense, many ARMed ChromeBooks do make nice desktop PCs. They can add extensive storage via USB or Ethernet. My reason for not choosing one of them for my purposes is that I really don’t need/want a small display and keyboard and I really want the ability to have a lot more RAM and a more powerful CPU.

  47. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “The market has decided that ARM makes sense everywhere. There were billions of processors sold last year. ”

    The problem is Robert Pogson, that “everywhere” does not include systems capable of functioning as fully capable personal desktop computers. If you are lucky, your mobile device will have an SD card slot that can accept a single 256Gb Micro SD card. While that is a lot of space for many, it is not the same the ability of having multiple multi TB drives attached. for that capability, you are limited to the developer board niche that you are too cheap to pay for.

    However, you may have gotten lucky with the Lemaker decision to create the Cello. Assuming that it actually ships and you take delivery on one that actually works. Lets see what you can do with it.

  48. dougman says:

    “I just prefer one box instead of two or more.”

    Ummm, you are just reduplicating things that are in existence already. Your cable modem handles DHCP and routing just fine, but no, lets do it the Pogson hard way.

    “Life is simpler.”

    Not for you, see above. The money spent on the Chinese walking tractor could have had you a very nice UNRAID box running a REAL server board with 15 drives like me.

    “My server will be a much better NAS than many of the products on the market: more drives, more capacity and greater security.”

    Server? What a laugh!! I can get 80MB/s over NFS. I bet you you won’t see 250KB/sec throughput.

  49. dougman says:

    “but normally I would not want such a small display and keyboard.”

    Since when is a 14″ / 15″ screen small, what are you blind? You advocate smart thingy’s which do have a small ass screen, but turn your nose up at a Linux device. What a hypocrite!

  50. kurkosdr wrote, “Building DHCP and routers out of PCs (a task which a plain router box like the one every ISP gives nowadays can do just fine with less power consumption), building SQL databases for stuff that a set of word files on a USB disk would suffice (with the added convenience of being portable), building homemade fileservers instead of buying a proper NAS… There is literally no limit to how full-on-Rube-Goldberg those guys can go.”

    I just prefer one box instead of two or more. Life is simpler. My server will be a much better NAS than many of the products on the market: more drives, more capacity and greater security. I also want to do web, ftp, database so the software has to run somewhere. It’s better on the same machine, no network-latency. Beast has demonstrated that since version I. GNU/Linux is a proper OS. It can do all of these tasks and run a desktop all on one machine.

  51. dougman wrote, “I just a fully functional Chromebook, for what you are paying for your unusable Jello board.”

    There are Chromebooks up the pipe with A-72s but they still lack RAM and are pricey. A display could be useful for when booting fails with a new kernel etc. but normally I would not want such a small display and keyboard.

  52. dougman says:

    “dougman, thinking he’s entitled to tell me what to do about IT”

    Whereas you do the exact same thing routinely hypocrite.

    Such titles as :

    M$ Uses GNU/Linux. Why Not You?
    Debian — Reasons to Choose Debian
    Time For the GNU/Linux Desktop
    OMG! M$ Ships Debian GNU/Linux!!!?!
    Debian’s Here, There and Everywhere (almost)
    Yet Another Reason To Use Debian GNU/Linux
    Start Talking About the GNU/Linux Desktop

    “Need the latest OS to fight malware/hackers or run the latest software? Go GNU/Linux! It will work for you on old or new hardware and you needn’t worry about paying M$ ever again and you may never again be forced to change your OS just because you buy new hardware.”

    BTW: I just a fully functional Chromebook, for what you are paying for your unusable Jello board.

  53. kurkosdr says:

    Lol, I am always amazed by the things people come up to waste their time. Building DHCP and routers out of PCs (a task which a plain router box like the one every ISP gives nowadays can do just fine with less power consumption), building SQL databases for stuff that a set of word files on a USB disk would suffice (with the added convenience of being portable), building homemade fileservers instead of buying a proper NAS… There is literally no limit to how full-on-Rube-Goldberg those guys can go. Now excuse me, but I have to fire up the automatic sock dispenser I built in my drawer using a Raspberry Pi and some Lego Technic bit. Oh yeah I would never do such a thing, I just reach out for my socks and use the time I saved not building a sock dispenser to get drunk with friends or view The Grand Tour (using Exodus for Kodi). You know, normie stuff (shame on me).

    Just build a NAS, as I have no idea how in the hell you will connect a raid array to your mousetrap board along with a raid controller, as you have a unusable PCI slot, let alone multiple hard drives.
    I would imagine something that has to do with a USB hub and multiple high-bandwidth hard-drives hitting the single USB controller behind the USB hub. On a second thought, Pog might come with a better idea: Some leftover wire, a soldering iron and a McGyver handbook, there done! Totally gets 100KB per second.

  54. dougman, thinking he’s entitled to tell me what to do about IT wrote, “Web? You are going to host mrpogson.com on this? Are you kidding?? One, you provider probably won’t let you and two, your existing cable box handle’s this function already.”

    I use a host of local web-applications like databases of images, recipes, and collections of pictures of plants/flowers/seeds etc. Beast was providing many other web-pages to schools in which I worked and for which it was totally impractical to use the limited bandwidth of our ISP to connect to a remote server. I run my home the same way because Beast has all kinds of reserve capacity for these kinds of things. I have 35 MySQL databases on the go but most are archives of some kind or other, stuff I’ve collected or organized over my career. Recipes, reloads, notes, images, and contacts are the ones I use most often. My reloads db shows 135 batches of ammunition totalling over 2K rounds with technical details, results, date… I’ve been reloading for decades but I’ve only recently started that db. I intend to shoot more in my retirement particularly if I get an electric car. The databases could just as well be run on mrpogson.com’s server but that would cause unnecessary expense. I’m going to have a server whether you want me to have one or not so it may as well reside here.

  55. dougman says:

    “The board will be used as router, DHCP server, database, web, storage for “home” directories and backups, as well as the most powerful CPU on the LAN for things like building the kernel.”

    LOL….do people still do that silly shit? Dump everything on little box, oh wait your dumping everything on a stupid joke board. The modem that your cable provider sends you can handle routing and DHCP. But no, lets make things 10x harder then they already are and use a wallet-sized breadboard.

    Database for what?

    Web? You are going to host mrpogson.com on this? Are you kidding?? One, you provider probably won’t let you and two, your existing cable box handle’s this function already.

    Storage for “home” directories and backups? Just build a NAS, as I have no idea how in the hell you will connect a raid array to your mousetrap board along with a raid controller, as you have a unusable PCI slot, let alone multiple hard drives.

    I just purchased two more WD 4TB reds for my NAS, so as to swap out a single aged parity, and replace with dual parity drives. The aged drive will be recycled back into the array.

  56. The Wiz wrote, “the market will dictate what you get”.

    The market has decided that ARM makes sense everywhere. There were billions of processors sold last year. Even smartphones are getting A-72. Some developer-board will get that this year or next.

    e.g. This one: gigabit, USB3 and PCI-e, no SATA but with 4gB on the board. That would beat a nonexistent Cello easily and I already have a working PCI-e SATA card and USB NIC for an Internet connection. That could work.

  57. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Why? I’ll be the decider of that. Gigabit and SATA and DDR3/4 are not rocket-science. ”

    You can “decide” all you want, but the market will dictate what you get.

  58. kurkosdr wrote, “I noticed that since you haven’t any tasks on the list which are resource-demanding and real-time (you are not really going to use this as a router, right?”

    Yes. What do you think is in my current router? A Xeon? Nope it’s a tiny ARMed chip. Throughput only needs to be 150mbits/s to keep up with the ISP. Even the Odroid-C2 could do that better than my present router.

  59. The Wiz wrote, “You want an ARM board that you can use for a server, your going to have to pay a lot more for it than YOU think that you should have to”.

    Why? I’ll be the decider of that. Gigabit and SATA and DDR3/4 are not rocket-science. The building blocks for them exist and ARM’s licensees can plug them in rather cheaply. It’s disappointing to see that servers have not swallowed a lot of ARMed chips at the moment but that will come. All it takes is a tiny bit of volume and the prices will be quite affordable. The question is the chicken and egg thing. Will developers get their hands on enough units to make a wider variety of software available or will emulators have to do? All the software I need is available on ARM64. All I need is the hardware. If necessary I can lash up a cluster of Odroid-C2s. TLW’s unit is behaving rather well lately. It just needs more RAM.

  60. Deaf Spy says:

    The board will be used as router, DHCP server, database, web, storage for “home” directories and backups, as well as the most powerful CPU on the LAN for things like building the kernel.

    I still think your venerable Beast will fare better than A7, Robert.

    See here. A-72 is going into smartphones now.

    I see, but you obviously don’t. Can’t you tell the difference between a smartphone and a server? That was rhetoric. Of course you can’t. Let me outline one very important difference for you.

    Smartphones, Robert, and their OSes, are very carefully designed to conserve memory and CPU. For example, when an app goes to background, it is usually suspended completely. It can be even purged from RAM. Only one app is supposed to be running, and that is the app on the foreground. Background activities, while possible, are highly discouraged and recommended for specific cases like media player.

    That should tell you, Robert, that despite all the RAMs and cores and caches, ARM chips at the end of the day focus on a single app at a time. Of course, to improve user experience, mobile apps are naturally composed of multiple threads that utilize the cores.

    Now I will leave it to you to draw the conclusion. Not that I have high expectations here, but still worth the fun.

    The world has accepted ARM.

    Only on smartphones, IoT, and tablets. The latter start to lose their ground, btw, giving way to 2-in-1s, which are powered by Intel.

  61. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “If AMD can’t deliver I will take A-72 from someone else. With ARM, I’m not locked into any particular supplier.”

    If price were no object for you Robert Pogson, I would agree with you. However you also want it cheap. And the “cheap” ARM developent boards, regardless of which SOC is delivered on them are aimed at the IoT Developer market, not some inveterate cheapskate looking to use a development board for his server.

    You want an ARM board that you can use for a server, your going to have to pay a lot more for it than YOU think that you should have to .

  62. kurkosdr says:

    The board will be used as router, DHCP server, database, web, storage for “home” directories and backups, as well as the most powerful CPU on the LAN for things like building the kernel.

    And you want to do those on an A57, most likely hampered by poor board engineering? One of the reasons I didn’t manage to use my ODROID u3 as an Android microconsole was because the poor board engineering of ODROID meant it had less raw CPU and GPU performance compared to my Galaxy S3 (which uses the exact same SoC but on a much more thermally constrained form factor), and the GPU of the ODROID U3 had micro-stuttering too (again compared to the Galaxy S3).

    Since the LeMaker folks can’t hack a PCI-E slot together, don’t get too excited about them giving you the full potential of the SoC.

    But I noticed that since you haven’t any tasks on the list which are resource-demanding and real-time (you are not really going to use this as a router, right? if you do it will be major lulz) and since there are no time constraints (because your time is apparently infinite), you can give the tasks arbitrary amounts of time to finish, and hence still consider your needs covered and claim success.

    Meanwhile, normal people will buy an Intel or AMD x86 board which will be cheaper and have less TDP (peak) and will be better engineered. Of course, they will miss the “pleasure” of trying to hack the awful drivers that LeMaker will provide into working with Linux and will instead spend their time doing social stuff like going to the movies or to dinner with a friend, but I guess you can’t have it all, right?

  63. Deaf Spy wrote, “The A57 is probably not strong enough for the “non-micro server” market”.

    Beast is definitely a microserver. A57 is good enough for that. If AMD can’t deliver I will take A-72 from someone else. With ARM, I’m not locked into any particular supplier.

  64. Deaf Spy, not seeing any light at the end of the tunnel, wrote, “ARM have nothing in store to put in the arena”.

    See here. A-72 is going into smartphones now. It can be on a small motherboard I can use shortly.

  65. kurkosdr wrote, “since the board will be used occasionally as a file servervand maybe and as a remote-processing thingie to power the limited needs of TLW’s(tm) thin-client”

    Nope. The board will be used as router, DHCP server, database, web, storage for “home” directories and backups, as well as the most powerful CPU on the LAN for things like building the kernel.

    kurkosdr wrote, “I think you should only compare current offerings when making your purchase decisions (in terms of performance per buck and TDP too).”

    No. I can compare what I have with what I want to have. I want much lower power consumption and smaller size while increasing RAM and storage greatly. I don’t want to pay for an Intel CPU when I don’t require one. Same goes for AMD. They’ve missed the boat. The world has accepted ARM. Why shouldn’t I?

  66. kurkosdr says:

    It’s a fact that I paid $200 for Beast’s current CPU

    And my dad once paid the equivalent of 2000 bucks for a Pentium 200MHz MMX with 32MBs of RAM, but I think you should only compare current offerings when making your purchase decisions (in terms of performance per buck and TDP too).

    Haven’t you heard about depreciation and Moore’s law?

    Anyway, rational purchase decisions is not what you are after, neither is utility, since the board will be used occasionally as a file servervand maybe and as a remote-processing thingie to power the limited needs of TLW’s(tm) thin-client, so when you set the requirements so low, you can buy anything and still call it a win, while boasting about how you stuck it to evil Intel or whatever the evil empire of the year is. And those 300 bucks? Chump change I guess (well not, but whatever)

  67. Deaf Spy says:

    The Cello’s real problem is that someone, probably AMD, really messed up on production/marketing. They are late to market and apparently with a defective/not fully supported product.

    Haven’t it occurred to you, Robert, that perhaps AMD didn’t care to market a product, for which there is no real market? See my quotes below, but all analysis and real-world tests demonstrate that ARM is definitely not there yet, and is good only for static cache servers (where the CPU is merely getting the rig going, and all work is done by the peripherals).

    Server market, even low-power one, is ruled by Xeon-D, and ARM have nothing in store to put in the arena. Seeing ARM’s latest keynotes, it seems ARM don’t care of servers. All they care of is IoT.

  68. Deaf Spy says:

    It is a fact you compare apples to oranges, Robert. You can’t compare an early 2000 CPU with a mid 2010 CPU.

    Further, you fail to get a cue from people who know. Let me quote engineers from Facebook about their experience with ARM servers:
    But that solution didn’t work well because the single-thread performance was too low, resulting in higher latency for our web platform. Based on that experiment, we set our sights on higher-power processors while maintaining the modular SoC approach

    And another quote by AnandTech specialists:
    There are some chances here, but we would really like to see some real products instead of yet another slide deck with great promises. Frankly we don’t think that the standard ARM designs will do. The A57 is probably not strong enough for the “non-micro server” market

    Now, Robert, I am pretty certain that your current Beast will outperform the Cello in any job except for media processing or some synthetic JS tests.

  69. kurkosdr wrote, “no facts (TDP or price)”.

    It’s a fact that I paid $200 for Beast’s current CPU. It’s a fact that CPU burns 95W flat out and probably 70W idling while Cello uses perhaps 10W going flat out. The $300 is not just for CPU but CPU and motherboard. I grant you that an x86/amd64 motherboard would be a better deal but an Intel CPU would not. I have an Intel CPU in my home now and it’s a disgustingly slow thing. Intel does not deserve my custom, as small as it may be.

    The Cello’s real problem is that someone, probably AMD, really messed up on production/marketing. They are late to market and apparently with a defective/not fully supported product. I can’t do much about that but I can buy a similar product when it comes around. Already there are smartphones in the pipe with A-72 CPUs. Someone will dump a cache on those things and real RAM sooner or later.

  70. kurkosdr says:

    I hate waste. We can do in software what x86 does in silicon cheaper and using less power and silicon.

    Do you have TDP numbers (relevant to the form factor) to support that power claim of yours?

    Also, you do realise the extra silicon area is not that much, and the bill is picked up by Intel or AMD (economies of scale) because the intel-socketed board plus intel cpu (or AMD socketed-board with AMD would cost you less than the Cello board you want to buy.

    Anyway, what I am saying here is that you are performing two basic mistakes:
    1) Buying on a false idea (=that a cheaper system is a “treadmill” despite the fact that no facts (TDP or price) support your claim)
    and
    2) Employing bleeding-edge in production, aka dropping an unproven piece of software (drivers) and hardware in a situation where it is expected to perform everyday tasks.

    On the other hand, I am a proud owner of an ODROID U3 which I attempted to use as a real Android gaming microconsole, so I cannot claim complete innocence from that falacy either… but 300 bucks? Gimme a fricking break.

  71. kurkosdr wrote, “why do you hate x86”.

    I hate waste. We can do in software what x86 does in silicon cheaper and using less power and silicon.

  72. kurkosdr says:

    Port to 80386 came only later on, when it became clear MIPS was also a lost cause for the market.

    And of course, MIPS was the best of ISAs out there. It didn’t have the CISC cruft of x86 (which needs to be JITed) and didn’t have the multiple useless registers known as “register windows” that were supposed to make procedure calls faster but didn’t, like SPARC had.

    But SGI -the parent companyt decided the future was on Itanium (a single-vendor ISA nobody other than Intel -the vendor- wanted) and just stopped developing the chips. So SPARC won the workstation market, before the market itself was killed by the Pentium III and Windows 2000.

    Though a variant of the MIPS architecture lives on inside BluRay players and such where no compat requirements exist and the chip manufacturers can pick the ISA that allows to make chips with the most performance per buck.

  73. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “This, Robert, is wishful thinking, so typical of flossies. ”

    Actually its only typical of moocher types like Robert Pogson, who contribute zip to their “cause” The Developers who actually spring for a board like the Cello expect to have to get their hands dirty – possibly even writing the driver code themselves.

    Though to be perfectly blunt, any company who sells a board that is as broken as the Cello is with its non-working PCI slot deserves nobody’s support.

  74. Deaf Spy says:

    Windows NT was ported to PowerPC

    Actually, Kurks, NT was ported to x86. It was originally developed for some obscure Intel RISK chip, which never saw the light, and then for MIPS. Port to 80386 came only later on, when it became clear MIPS was also a lost cause for the market.

  75. Deaf Spy says:

    It’s part of the Wintel treadmill.

    An interesting detail, Robert, future devices actually may have both Intel and ARM chips. For reference, Microsoft Surface Studio does it. It uses an Cortex A57 to boost the display.

    there will be developers contributing to the mainline Linux kernel and the “problem” is solved

    This, Robert, is wishful thinking, so typical of flossies. Except that it basically doesn’t happen. Current Linux development happens only as driven by major corporations. For example, no developers contributed to video drivers for Linux. It all went to the graphic chip manufacturers. Irony is, there Intel has the crown of giving the best open-source driver.

  76. kurkosdr says:

    making voted out = making cores out (don’t know how autocorrect mixed up the two)

  77. kurkosdr says:

    M$ and Intel conspired to over-charge the world for decades for CPUs and operating systems by forcing a monopoly.

    How did Intel and Microsoft conspired exactly? For all I know, Windows NT was ported to PowerPC (discontinued due to lack of interest by the buying public on the virtue that the buying public still had tons of bought software that was x86) and Microsoft supported every mobile architecture under the sun in Windows CE, from Sharp to ARM. Microsoft once pursued the Singularity project to get rid of ISA dependence entirely. Intel had (and has) no problem selling their CPUs for every use, from Linux netbooks to large x86-64 servers. A sane person could say that “Wintel” was a requirement the customers imposed on both companies for compatibility reasons with existing bought x86 software and that even if each company acted in a monopoly manner independently, there is no evidence they acted in a monopoly manner together in a conspiratorial way, in fact there is evidence to the contrary (see above), but you see, I do not possess the apocryphal knowledge you possess and I hope you are willing to share with me.

    The court-settlement of that did nothing to undo the damage and it certainly didn’t compensate me for over-spending on CPUs for a decade or more. By not buying Intel, I’m correcting that deficiency.

    A previous commenter has demonstrated that the intel-socketed board with a cheap Intel CPU is cheaper than your Cello and hence a clear bargain, even if we assume the Cello works, so you won’t be overspending this time. But even if Intel is evil, there is still AMD. So, even if you hate Intel, why do you hate x86. Do you buy into the nonsense that ARM is an “open” architecture, despite being neither royalty-free nor having an abundance of companies making voted out there? (It’s ARM itself and Qualcomm last time I checked)

  78. Wizard Emeritus says:

    ” By not buying Intel, I’m correcting that deficiency.”

    All you are doing is pissing into the wind Robert Pogson. The world will continue to purchase x86-64 class hardware and implement whatever they want on it whether you like it or not.

  79. DrLoser wrote, “Big ole annuity that must be, Robert. You finally scraped up $150 or so to buy yet another item of functionally useless crap?”

    The capital is there. My annuity will rise sharply in January as the amount will be recalculated based on the balance on Dec 31. I do spend money on other things than IT and I do have several projects in the pipe. I recently bought wheels for the cart I’ve made for the alternator. I plan to replenish my stock of reloading components in 2016. The Cello will have to wait in the queue and I don’t think I will pre-order it so that leaves January or even February. I expect there will be some tweaks to the software/firmware to smooth the rough edges in that period too. I’d prefer to have the glitches ironed out before I buy one.

  80. Deaf Spy quoth, “So the first batch LeMaker Cello will be the early-bird version for experienced developers, server companies and open source community, we do not suggest newbie or general users to buy the LeMaker Cello at the early-bird stage.”

    Cello and HuskyBoards have been around since 2015 for the “early-birds”. RedHat was using HuskyBoard as server development, and desktops in 2015. There’s no problem keeping Odroid-C2 running. I don’t think there will be any problem with Cello. As soon as it is mass-produced there will be developers contributing to the mainline Linux kernel and the “problem” is solved. Actually there is no problem.

  81. kurkosdr wrote, “can you explain to me, the unworthy ignoramus, why an intel-socketed board is considered a “treadmill”?”

    It’s part of the Wintel treadmill. M$ and Intel conspired to over-charge the world for decades for CPUs and operating systems by forcing a monopoly. At one point Intel paid customers not to use AMD devices. The court-settlement of that did nothing to undo the damage and it certainly didn’t compensate me for over-spending on CPUs for a decade or more. By not buying Intel, I’m correcting that deficiency.

  82. kurkosdr says:

    oh, and it’s Intel-socketed. No thanks. I’m off the treadmill forever.

    Oh dear Pog, can you explain to me, the unworthy ignoramus, why an intel-socketed board is considered a “treadmill”?

  83. Deaf Spy says:

    From Cello’s page:

    Although the LeMaker Cello will installed a boot OS and some baisc software, it will still have some dev bugs that need to update the OS to solve the bugs.

    Translation: we may provide an image that boots; don’t expect to install anything else on it; don’t expect to install your favourite distro, regardless what they say on their web site; in future we might do some updates of our images, but don’t put your hopes too high.

    Followed by:

    So the first batch LeMaker Cello will be the early-bird version for experienced developers, server companies and open source community, we do not suggest newbie or general users to buy the LeMaker Cello at the early-bird stage.

    Tell me, Robert, are you an experienced developer?

    Are you ready to join the other 46 buyers? 🙂

  84. dougman says:

    “Can you cite me a customer for a 4U server that requires anything like 480 TB of data storage?”

    Since when is smaller bad? Your argument is stupid, as floor space is limited at many businesses. ON top of that, the storage cost per GB is cheaper than S3 and Azure.

    Two servers, on onsite and one offsite can handle the backup needs for a SMB. I don;t have to cite you a damn thing, that’s what Google is for.

    Loser.

  85. dougman says:

    “Conveniently omitting the case…”

    Why should I include a case, when your joke board has none?

  86. DrLoser says:

    Big ole annuity that must be, Robert. You finally scraped up $150 or so to buy yet another item of functionally useless crap?

    So much for the stocks and bonds expertise.

  87. dougman wrote, “the cost of the motherboard and CPU equals the cost of your joke board.”

    Conveniently omitting the case…

  88. DrLoser says:

    BTW: let me know when you can find 480 terabytes of data storage in a 4U server, with a HP or Dell badge on it.

    What a lovely little straw-man, Dog-Brain. Can you cite me a customer for a 4U server that requires anything like 480 TB of data storage? Because that’s not how modern server farms work. Google, Microsoft, Facebook, Amazon et al rack a few thousand 4U servers in a data center and spec each one at (I forget, but something like) a mere sixteen terabytes.

    This turns out to be more than sufficient for yer average Map-Reduce system. Invented by Alonzo Church, revivified by Google, arguably plagiarised by Amazon and by Microsoft Bing or Azure, and no doubt a feature of Facebook and any other large-scale social media site out there.

    Also available in FLOSS form via Hadoop, btw, but Hadoop is not much more than cheap garbage, as is usual for FLOSS.

    Now, if you’re talking about NASA or meteorological sites or similar types of applications that require ~500TB per server, then that’s fine. Have at it.

    But it’s a particularly stupid (even by your standards) comparison, because these types of applications are HPCs … and they have very specialized needs.

  89. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Are you trying to compare a regular server to a custom-built open-source hardware NAS? I would have thought you would have been smarter then that. ”

    And I would have thought you were smarter to call some brand X cobble-together a “real Server”.

    Real servers setup that need to scale into the 100’s of TB range put their bulk storage in external arrays. Its more flexible that way. Of course, I should not be telling you anything that you already don’t know, eh Dougie?

  90. dougman says:

    “You need only go look at an HPE Proliant 560-DL Gen9 or Dell Poweredge R830 (and these are the baby systems BTW) to see what I am talking about.”

    Are you trying to compare a regular server to a custom-built open-source hardware NAS? I would have thought you would have been smarter then that. The backblaze is just a storage box, that’s it. Boot-up Linux from a thumb drive and off you go.

    The link I provided previously was version 4, here is version 6.

    https://www.backblaze.com/blog/open-source-data-storage-server/

    BTW: let me know when you can find 480 terabytes of data storage in a 4U server, with a HP or Dell badge on it.

  91. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Here is an example of a REAL server. ”

    As someone who made his living specifying and implementing “real servers” I can assure you that your $9000.00 toy is not even close either. You need only go look at an HPE Proliant 560-DL Gen9 or Dell Poweredge R830 (and these are the baby systems BTW) to see what I am talking about.

  92. Wizard Emeritus says:

    ” I only buy electronics based on irrelevant architectures (for form factor) made by boutique sloppy companies without driver support.”

    Au Contraire, Mr. K. Rember Robert Pogson is using the magic LInux OS, where all source code is available. All he had to do is roll up his sleeves then examine and adapt some of that existing code do LeMaker development work for them.

    Thats the FOSS way after all…

  93. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “No thanks. I’m off the treadmill forever.”

    Then you’d better hope that LeMaker comes through with something usable by you. Because if it doesn’t your only bet is going to be the server developer boards like the gigabyte MP3-AR0 for 3 times the cost. This is because the economies of scale that allow one to purchase server usable motherboards for cheap don’t exist in the ARM space – which is why your only bet for a server usable motherboard comes from a company whose track record for getting it out the door hasn’t been inspiring.

    Either way it should be interesting to shut up, sit back, and watch the show….

  94. dougman says:

    “Good luck doing anything with it without a CPU…”

    LOL, the cost of the motherboard and CPU equals the cost of your joke board.

    I run my server for VM’s, FTP, NAS and a media server for my movies/music. My case only cost me like a $100 USB and holds 15 drives Currently, I have 22TB of storage used, namely from movies, music amd DWM backups.

  95. dougman wrote, “The motherboard is a Supermicro MBD-X9SCL-F and half the cost of this Cello joke.”

    Good luck doing anything with it without a CPU… Then there’s the case… oh, and it’s Intel-socketed. No thanks. I’m off the treadmill forever.

  96. kurkosdr says:

    The motherboard is a Supermicro MBD-X9SCL-F and half the cost of this Cello joke.

    Yes but is it made by a small company that makes lots of engineering oopsies and no support? If not, it doesn’t cut it, get your economies of scale and sane business models out of my lawn. I only buy electronics based on irrelevant architectures (for form factor) made by boutique sloppy companies without driver support.

  97. dougman says:

    This Cello is a joke. It is NOT a server in any sense of the word, it is a TOY.

    Here is an example of a REAL server.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Igl6c4WeU0

    https://www.backblaze.com/blog/backblaze-storage-pod-4/

    The motherboard is a Supermicro MBD-X9SCL-F and half the cost of this Cello joke.

  98. DrLoser wrote, “Good luck with figuring out the drivers!”

    Runs GNU/Linux. Drivers are included.

  99. The Wiz wrote, “Robert Pogson has decided that the LeMaker Cello is the core of what he needs for his next generation server. Its his money, so now lets all sit back and see what he succeeds in doing with it…”

    Exactly! I know my needs and the Cello will do what I need for a minimal layout and will certainly be more reliable than a more powerful server running TOOS. I’ve seen enough of them. I also don’t want any more to do with the other half of Wintel. I’m getting very close. I have one printer that has an x86-only driver. I suppose it will still print if I emulate although it may take longer. That printer is nearly 10 years old. It could die soon and relieve me of that complication.

  100. Wizard Emeritus says:

    Gentlemen, and Dougie:

    I think we are missing the point. Robert Pogson has decided that the LeMaker Cello is the core of what he needs for his next generation server. Its his money, so now lets all sit back and see what he succeeds in doing with it…

    If he actually gets it. Remember LeMaker has only announced that it is restarting production of its board.

    I for one have come to the conclusion that we need to shut up, sit down and watch the show.

  101. dougman says:

    $300!……nothing like buying a dildo and screwing yourself.

  102. DrLoser says:

    The Lemaker Cello is still a piece of crap, Robert.
    Good luck with figuring out the drivers!

  103. Ivan says:

    For that price you could buy yourself a fully functional laptop/tablet that comes with a free year of Office 365.

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