Thinking Of Buying An Electric Vehicle

“Manitoba has among the lowest electricity rates in North America, making an EV inexpensive to charge. An EV that travels 15,000 km per year would use approximately the same amount of energy every year as a typical electric water heater. This equates to approximately $0.01 to $0.02 per km driven.”
 
See Electric vehicles
I don’t drive much. I’m so old I don’t do it for fun anymore just to go somewhere. My longest trip is about 30 miles. An electric vehicle could easily do the job. Some of my most frequent drives:

  • visiting my doctor,
  • picking up small parcels from the Post Office,
  • shopping for sundries, and
  • hunting, fishing and picking mushrooms and berries.

Except for retrieving a deer, even a tiny one-seater would do. I could probably debone a deer to make it fit in one of those. I wrote the company and they assured me a cello would fit. Those are about the same length as a rifle. The volume of storage will easily hold the meat of a deer but might not hold the rack. I sometimes hunt alone but I could call for help to fetch a deer. I know lots of people who would help to get a share…

There are lots of practical issues for me to use such a vehicle. Range could be an issue if I wanted to hunt/fish farther afield. Some have a range as little as 100 miles/160KM and less in winter. The handling of a tricycle on ice/snow is also an issue. OTOH, I surely would enjoy the freedom of jumping in “my” car and driving on some errand any time I like whether or not TLW is in town with the gas-guzzler. Chuckle. I could even see using this thing and charging from solar panels at home or in the field. If I had a remote hunting property within the range, I could drive all the way there, charge via solar over a few days and drive back, essentially doubling the useful range of the thing. There are a lot of desirable hunting/gathering properties available at double the range. This could work.

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.

This entry was posted in family, firearms, food, hunting, technology and tagged , . Bookmark the permalink.

21 Responses to Thinking Of Buying An Electric Vehicle

  1. oiaohm says:

    More likely head winds would be the issue but then I would have a tail wind coming back…
    That has forgotten something important.
    Murphy’s law says that anything that can go wrong, will go wrong (eventually)
    Its likely that at some point you will have head winds all the way because wind direction will have turned when you get to one end. That is also the problem with the flat ground range values they give you they normally base it on a theoretical zero wind day. The test is normally not performed on a real road either but one of those rolling roads in a shed.

    A few metres rise true flat and only wind you most likely could get away with a 1.5x multiplier. Add in driving into rain you now need 1.8x Only .2 was for hills and this is talking about fuel not electric.

    These numbers are basically the same when dealing with petrol or electric to a point. When you have a 1000Km road crossing the middle of nowhere find yourself range short can be kind of fatal. Each of those long Australian roads has a calculated multiplier to be safe and a calculated with no reserve. No reserve numbers start at 1.8x.

    I just find 2x simpler maths. Having extra is not exactly a problem find yourself short causes trouble. 3x is what is used in the Australian solar race for non competitive cars running on electricity to allow heat effects on battery loss and if the year happens to have nasty weather. 2x is used for the fuel based support cars/trucks. So 3000km race 6000km of fuel for what vehicle is calculated to-do in best conditions to allow for worst conditions. Failure to allow for this is how a lot of people end up out of fuel between home and work. They look at fuel gauge see what they do on a good day amount of fuel and attempt to drive home and get stuck short because it rained with wind against them.

    Fuel vehicle makers have allowed for human stupidity. When Fuel gauge read zero there is a percentage held back in reserve.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3213671/Why-never-drive-quarter-tank-fuel-827-000-break-year-ignoring-warning-light.html
    Quite a bit in fact. Thinking the Australian average is ~ 43 km per day when the warning light comes on the allow range is either almost a full day travel or over a full days travel. Then remember how often you are driving your fuel based vehicle and never be close. Also do note they say you should not be driving under quarter of tank that is 1.33x on something that in the case you can easy find somewhere to fill up. 1.33x is without rain not to get stuck with fuel based.

    Most people using fuel based are not aware they are most often using 2x or greater they get electric something and then find themselves getting stuck because they have not allowed for other things. A lot like you say 2x sound conservative what it is optimistic. Reality is you start at 1.33x after you and in rain storm hills and other things you normally find yourself at 2x and that is with fuel engines.

    http://newatlas.com/all-climate-lithium-battery/41429/
    Now new lithium batteries being experimented with heat-self. Unheated lithium battery cold kiss good bye to %40 of the capacity.

    3x can be conservative in Australia when you are in areas where the cold or heat does not nick off with %40 percent of battery.

    1.33 your car operating multiple divided by .6 to allow for loss of capacity due to cold. 1.33 /.6 takes you to 2.22 before you start allowing for wind and rain and battery ageing. Now if you use a 1.8 that is for a fairly flat road but to allow for weather. So 1.8/.6 comes out to 3x multiplier so you need 3 times the range you are expecting to be doing to be sure to make it.

    3x is being optimistic for Canada if everything that can go wrong does from the weather side in Canada 3x will not get you home with an electric with current generation batteries. When you add in 1/3 loss due to battery old age on top of cold the number comes 1.8/.4 what is 4.5 multiplier. So doing a 100km trip in electric conservative would say you need 500km range.

    This is the big trap with electric the battery. It makes all your general maths you use with fuel way wrong. If you use the normal maths for a fuel engine with electric you will end up stuck. Electric vehicle ranges are highly optimistic.

    Robert a lot of people get a electric then get stuck a lot then complain about it. The issue is they don’t get this multiplier right or don’t use a multiplier at all. Buy something way too tight on range so they get stuck. Someone who has used the right multiplier or too large of multiplier and remembers to charge and monitor battery properly does not end up stuck.

    Robert you will need to look up with snow and the like if you get that I don’t have numbers on how bad snow effects range.

  2. oiaohm wrote, “x3 can in fact be conservative depending on how much hill climbing you have to-do to get home”.

    Unless someone makes a hill between me and my remote property there’s no problem then. I live on an ancient lake-bed and the only hills are the result of glaciation/erosion and they are few and far between. There is no hill between me and Winnipeg and only a few metres rise between me and my doctor. More likely head winds would be the issue but then I would have a tail wind coming back…

  3. oiaohm says:

    Robert Pogson its the USA EPA regulations for toxic/flammable chemical storage and fire regulations because methanol burns clear is where the 50l comes from. It fact it based off UK regulation.
    http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/storageflammliquids.htm
    What is 50L per tank with a max of 5 tanks to something.

    Yes methanol flash point is under 55C is 11-12C.

    So yes the UK methanol is workable. Completely stupid that a 100L tank in a car or truck would have to be modified into 2 50L ones yet they are still allowed to be joined by a pipe. This also explains why a lot of gasoline cars for the UK have under a 50l fuel tank since gasoline flash point is -43 C and why a lot of diesels for that market have a strange mid tank partitions when the tank is over 50l so the tank counts as two tanks or more so passing UK stupidity.

    USA regulation says for a normal home equal to 1 50l container of liquids per flammable liquid type without a permit unless it is a registered vehicle fuel then you are allowed more. Gasoline and Diesel and a few other fuels are registered vehicle fuel and methanol is not at this stage. Leading to people doing the stupid to get around the limitation.

    USA regulation around methanol needs a update that people do in fact use it as car and truck fuel so allowing sane storage values. Basically put it in the box as a vehicle fuel and the litres of storage would come sane.

    UK could loss some insanity about tank size.

    To be correct Australia is 150l without permit. With permit in Australia as much as you are able to fit on property and be inside fire regulations.

    Since you are in Canada Robert the limit is what ever amount you have safe housing for of methanol. Methanol is a recognised vehicle fuel in Canada.

    What rule is that? With trucks and cars having 100L tanks, that’s not really enforceable.
    That is why the regulation Australian reg is a 150L because requiring tanks to be split in 2 like the UK regulation is complete stupid. So 150L was set as that is what a vehicle in most cases have per tank max . In Australia a vehicle is a independent value when it comes to the totals as well. So 150L on property and 150L in each vehicle on property is legal. So we have some regulation but is really does not get in way of using methanol as a fuel.

    The process to make methanol is simple science. Methanol handled correctly with correct connectors and storage is quite safe. Lot safer than carting around a wood gasifier. If you happen to be in a country that Methanol has either sane storage limits or is recognised as vehicle fuel with the same limits as gasoline or diesel there is very limit point to converting vehicle to directly to run on wood gas.

    Yes there has been a lot of recent stuff in the USA of people converting stuff to run on wood gas and most people fail to spot what is causing is the regulation over how much methanol can be stored and that machines transporting around a gasifier is not exactly safe.

    You have lined the inside of the gasifier so it does not burn out then you drive it around exposing it to vibrations over and over again so cracking the lining. It totally makes no sense to transport a wood gas gasifier in the general usage cases. Wood gas gasifier sitting in a fixed location making methanol will have a very long operational life put the same item on a car/truck it will need 6 monthly inspections instead of 3 yearly ones of the non moving and the non moving one has been run 24/7 so have done many more hours of operation with way less maintenance. Cost effective says you never put a wood gas gasifer on a vehicle. Now if you are needing to have unlimited range with easy access to fuel for some reason then you fit wood gas gasifer but this not your common usage and not the most cost effective.

    Robert
    That is an extremely conservative number.
    x3 is not conservative it seams that way until you remember that the travel distance numbers per change they give you is on perfectly flat road. x2 is kind the min. Vehicle going up hill is going to hurt power usage way more than flat. You can fairly much bet where you will run out of battery is when you have to go up a hill.

    x3 can in fact be conservative depending on how much hill climbing you have to-do to get home. There is a place here in Australia where you have to use a x8 calculation due to how steep the hill the person has to travel up and the limited percentage got back by regeneration. x3 is allowing 1/3 of battery capacity loss due to old age with the normal x2 multiplier to allow for average hills and be sure you get over them with some cargo. Same problem happen when people read ideal miles from a gasoline and diesel then attempt to-do that and cannot work out why they don’t even get close.

  4. DrLoser wrote, “you could get an electric lawnmower these days that would fit the bill”.

    I have a gasoline mower that I could use now but it’s a gas-guzzler with about 6m/h top end. Folks could run me down in the blink of an eye. The EVs at least can keep up with traffic. If a guy were on cruise-control and tried to run me down in the Solo, I could accelerate. The top end is ~150km/h. I might try 100 km/h just to try it out once but my cruising speed is normally 80 on the highway, 60 on secondary roads and 40 in typical residential areas simply because I save on drag with lower air-speeds and I have more time to react to changing situations like kids/deer running onto the roadway. I’ve only once touched a deer and that was one that came out of the darkness completely invisible to me. I was going slow enough I was almost stopped when we touched and the deer simply left a hoof-print on my fender. At 100 that deer probably would have been severely injured and much greater damage done to my truck. I also avoid driving at night if I can help it simply because hazards are harder to see.

  5. dougman wrote, “biodiesel does not explode”.

    You can make any liquid fuel explosive simply by obtaining the right air-fuel mixture. Lots of people have blown themselves up by welding on a tank that contained some kind of organic liquids. I’ve written on this subject before. Bio-diesel might have a narrow range of mix that’s explosive but it will still have some condition that will make it so. It could be temperature in closed vessel of air, misting, mixing with some other fuel etc.

    Many liquid fuels have formulas like nCH2. Stoichiometric ratios modelling complete combustion are likely very exothermic and explosive as combustion will raise the temperature and increase rates of combustion rapidly. 2CH2 + 3O2 -> 2CO2 + 2H2O + heat

    Besides the mix ratio, one needs some minimal pressure to ensure rates of combustion are high enough to be called an explosion. Usually one atmosphere is enough for fuels like gasoline. For heavier oils one might require higher pressures or a more vigorous oxidizer than oxygen. Obviously, fuel oil and ammonium nitrate can form explosive mixtures. It probably doesn’t matter what kind of oil is used because ammonium nitrate is an explosive by itself and a product of the explosion is free oxygen at very high temperature and pressure sufficient to oxidize any fuel.

  6. oiaohm wrote, “distance being the distance you expect to need to cover to get out of trouble times by 3”.

    That is an extremely conservative number. Likely aging is monitored internally so the readout gives you time to prepare. One can also record charge versus distance much as fuel consumption versus distance is a diagnostic for a liquid fuelled care. Again, for my usage pattern of “out and back”, the problem would likely arise fairly close to home, say in the last few miles. I can walk that far and return with a generator. Charging for a few minutes would likely get me all the way home.

    Where this consideration would be more critical is me buying a distant property for farming/hunting/growing and putting it a little too far away. Again, I could carry some kind of solar/fuelled generator for such trips although that would take space away from luggage. If I can charge at a lower rate to get enough charge to complete the trip using a small portable device, this could work. When the problem arises, I could just buy a new battery. The company expects batteries to improve in price/capacity/charging rate with time so buying a new battery might be very beneficial sooner rather than later. Another option is pushing the darn thing. It’s so small that could work on level ground or downhill. We did that a lot in the 1950s. One put the girlfriend in the driver’s seat, told her not to apply the brake and volunteers pushed cars arbitrary distances to start them or to reach fuelling stations. These things have pretty large tires and low rolling resistance. Clearly, they are not designed to be towed but I could make a custom towing strap to do it safely, something like a sling to fit round the body distributing the towing forces. That might mess up the paint/plastic so I would take care to use a soft material and a shock-absorber. Alternatively one could drive/push it onto a trolly with its own wheels and tow the trolly. If I were commuting to an inhabited place I could phone for the trolly to be brought out a few miles. Where there’s a will, there’s a way.

    Electrics are very reliable. If running out of charge is the main disadvantage one could buy an extra battery to be kept charged and run the usual charging connection from that to impart a partial charge in a hurry from a wagon/trailer or the back of a pickup. A small wagon can be pulled by a bicycle if needed. I could attach a crude trailer hitch to the rear axle or frame of a bicycle pretty easily. So, as long as you have a bit of help and some redundant equipment running out is not a killer.

  7. oiaohm wrote, “a limit legal limitation where you are only allowed 50l of methanol in a home in the USA.”

    What rule is that? With trucks and cars having 100L tanks, that’s not really enforceable. I know in Canada lots of farmers have ~1KL tanks on the property for gasoline. I doubt anyone checks to see whether there is methanol aboard. Methanol is quite toxic, for sure, but making it has been a standard science project in schools for ages. It’s rather low tech and simple: heat the wood in an enclosed space until the vapour temperature rises above 80C near the condenser. A byproduct is charcoal. Most tanks that will hold gasoline without leaking will hold methanol and it is a regular additive in winter gasoline here. A guy with lots of firewood could easily make a decent supply of methanol for powering engines. To reduce hazards proper filling nozzles/couplings are available rather than exposing the stuff to the air. It’s fairly easy to ensure no fuel is left uncombusted with the usual exhaust oxygen measurement. Mixing with lubricating oil could be a problem. One might have to burn waste oil or superheat it and burn vapours instead of sending it directly for recycling.

  8. oiaohm says:

    dougman when someone looked at wood gas to run stuff I tell them to consider wood gas to methanol.
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0167582684900470

    Yes methanol is used in biodiesel production and is not particularly safe. A multi fuel engine can run on pure methanol, ethanol or normal gasoline. The thing about methanol production using a wood gasifier is that you are not transporting all over the place an gasifier with the risks the gasifier has. From usage safety biodiesel is safer but production is not particularly better.

    Why in the USA people are going back to wood gasifiers is a limit legal limitation where you are only allowed 50l of methanol in a home in the USA. For attempting to use methanol as a fuel this is quite limiting when you have a 50l limit. The process to go from methanol to diesel or gasoline is quite down right complex.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1SDAgLn-tk
    But it not impossible you would say its out of reach of home production if it was not the 50l methanol limit would not even be a problem. This is the problem wood gas is a short cut but like most short cuts there are risks involved.

    The reality here is if diesel/gasoline from wood is made home producible you would not be looking at the extra risks of wood gas production on vehicle. Methanol is the first liquid fuel you can product from wood gas. Yet in the USA you cannot really store any major volume of it. Please note that 50l limit of Methanol is total. So if you have a 40l fuel tank full of Methanol you are only allowed 10l somewhere else on the property in the USA. This is why it kinda stuffed. Australia we have 150l limit. So other than a few real odd cases you would not mess around with wood gas on a vehicle in Australia. Not when you can run on liquid fuel so be able to refill from any service station if you had to and place the production set-up in a nice secure location in case something goes wrong instead of on vehicle. The first gasification stage of wood gas is where the worst things happen. It also means if you have two vehicles you have less gasifiers to maintain. So you have a case in the USA where regulation around Methanol does not make perfect sense so people are doing more dangerous things like placing wood gas production units directly on vehicles instead of doing wood to Methanol.

  9. oiaohm says:

    If the battery is removable one could swap or transport the battery and charge it elsewhere.
    Most electrics with range the battery is too bulky to be swapped without performing a major operation on the machine. Solo the battery is segmented and spread across the base for stability of course that makes it a nightmare to try to change because it multi cells all over the place. Something like the telsa is better but the battery is still quite a large piece to attempt to remove by side of road.

    In something like a telsa that they state the number. 31Miles 50Km takes 1 hour of charging. This is if your battery is functional to peak. Not hindered by cold or heat or battery old age.

    Changing a battery on the side of road is practical in a normal fuel based system. In the electrics unless it something like a electric assisted bike changing the battery is fairly much out.

    It’s the same sort of risk any vehicle has such as running out of fuel, flat tire, or collision.
    Running out of fuel is fixable by bringing fuel. Issue with electrics is most case you cannot bring replacement batteries because the batteries are quite a large cost and even if you could fitting replacement batteries most cases requires a workshop to get electric off ground so you can replace the batteries.

    So some form generators either solar or fuel based is kind of required. Also if the solar or fuel based is not built into the electric you cannot be using them while you moving electric so resulting in you being stuck somewhere longer.

    Solar car races have really showing what an electric car needs to look like to be a electric car that will not get you into major trouble as will always be able to limp itself home or until a location where it can be repaired.

    I am not saying don’t get an electric they can be quite nice machines. Beware of the limitations. One of the key figures you are after out an electric is how long does it required charging to cover X distance. With X distance being the distance you expect to need to cover to get out of trouble times by 3. The times by 3 is to allow for old age of battery or just accept up front it end up flat somewhere you will pay towing charge or get home and go back with a fuel car and tow it. Yes is another thing people fail to check with a electric is how towable it is some are not very towable at all.

  10. oiaohm says:

    LOL….biodiesel does not explode you idiot, just like diesel does not explode. Hell, you cannot even light light diesel with a match. Totally off-topic, but with your ADD and dyslexia, I know you like to babble.

    No idiot your self biodiesel in the production stages can explode.
    https://sites.google.com/site/metropolitanforensics/explosions-and-fires-associated-with-commercial-and-home-biodiesel-production

    Biodiesel produces by-products when you are making it. Those by products are not handled properly they will explode and blow the complete area of production to kingdom come including acting as a dispensing change so speeding the Biodiesel and turn the Biodiesel into a fuel air explosive. So a Biodiesel plant goes bang twice first is the by products the second is the Biodiesel mixed with air. Scary part about the bang twice is there could be a 3 hour delay between first bang and the Biodiesel air fuel explode. Yep boom you wait hour or so walk in to inspect than the fuel air explosion happens so you are dead.

    Once you have the processed Biodiesel it is safe as normal diesel. The process of producing good Biodiesel that burns clean and well in the engine brings nightmares.

    Please note spread diesel into air or mix with a oxidising agent and it will explode perfectly well. Remember Biodiesel is made from recycled oils by those are home. Lets say some ammonia cleaner got mixed into the recycled oil some how remember that is a oxidising agent. To process the biodiesel at times the source oil gets heated. Heating and explosive mix of diesel with a oxidising agent is not a really good idea. Consider how many places use ammonia as a cleaner and you quickly work out how home Biodiesel production can go massively south.

    Yes mix ammonia with biodiesel or diesel you have an explosive. So biodiesel and diesel are safe when they are clean and not mixed with an oxidising agent. If you bubble pure O2 though diesel you can also get it to dissolve enough O2 to be explosive. So the old stunt saying that diesel cannot light light diesel with a match is not in fact true. It only true that you cannot light diesel with a match if the diesel is not contaminated with a strong oxidising agent. Attempting to light a small amount of diesel with a match is a test of purity if diesel lights it contaminated with something. In fact use a large match because it could in fact explode not just burn.

    LOL…your impropriety never fails to amaze me Ham-Dong. How the hell is gas going to burn a hole in the gasifier, when said gasifier is lined. You have no eff’n clue as to what you are talking about.
    Because wood that the wood gas is being produced from is not free of oxidising agents. Also wood gas is also can be highly acidic depending on the wood used. To be correct wood gas either burns a hole or acid eats though a hole either way if you are not careful you end up with air containing too much O2 mixed into an area that should be only wood gas leading to big explosion. NOx what basically makes nitric acid when mixed with water is inside the gasifier along with other fairly strong acids.

    Gasifiers of wood gas for driving engines are lined for a reason and they do need to be relined or replaced every so often or pay with your life because a hole will form somewhere resulting in the complete thing going boom.

    moonshine that is ethanol and methanol with other gas come out the wood gas processes. Yes the same reason a moonshine shed can blow to kingdom come is why a wood gas production unit can blow to kingdom come. Both are alcohol sources.

    There are a lot of legal issues to producing fuels because done wrong you can kill someone and that someone might not be you.

    So you have absolutely no clue on either of these topic yet you decided to but in like a idiot again dougman. Yet for some reason you want to call me a idiot when you are butting in not knowing the topics at all just because you want something to say I am wrong. Of course you but in with another incorrect myth.

  11. oiaohm wrote, “Electric tow job.”

    Not necessarily. If the battery is removable one could swap or transport the battery and charge it elsewhere. Likely a dead battery would be the result of lower temperatures or bad planning. If one was close to a destination with charging it may be feasible to transport the battery. I’m retired so a portable solar panel or generator may be options. My Lexus can easily carry a generator a few miles to do the job.

    It’s the same sort of risk any vehicle has such as running out of fuel, flat tire, or collision.

  12. oiaohm says:

    https://www.worldsolarchallenge.org/files/1504_2017_bwsc_regulations_final_release_version_11.pdf

    I don’t know much about lithium batteries except that I’ve seen a bunch bursting into flames or needing replacement after two or three years in mobiles…

    On this it can be good to read Australia World Solar Challenge regulations and other places. There are 4 lithium batteries types used. The safest being LiFePO but it at least twice as heavy for the same capacity.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Solar_Challenge

    Do note the 2005 winner. record average speed of 102.75 km/h Australian most common road top speed is 100km/h.

    http://www.solarteameindhoven.nl/stella-lux/
    This is the 2015 winner. A true 4 door car that with general driving and weather conditions never need to see a power point. Yes Stella Lux is a true road registered vehicle.

    Remember the solar cars address the biggest down size with pure electric cars is what to-do if you have a flat battery can cannot find somewhere to charge it. Solar car as long as it in the sun and you wait long enough it will charge.

    Of course I don’t call stuff like Stella Lux 100 percent ready. Stella Lux don’t have air bags and other safety things we expect in fuel based cars.

    This is the other downside of smog and global dimming. We totally got wrong what we could do with solar panels.

    I would also be suspect that the Solo you are looking at Robert has as in battery mass the same as the Stella Lux. But due to more compact size not enough roof area/panel to place solar charging. Remember car runs out of power on side of road for some reason. Old school fuel you can carry tank to car and get it moving. Solar car you sit it in sun and you will get it moving after enough time passes. Electric tow job. Something like a Tesla takes 9.5 hours to charge fully. How long will a Solo take to charge fully. Depending on where you are with something like a Stella Lux you might never charge it because the sun is always topping it up and you mileage per month will never get the battery flat and even if you do something expectational it has to be fairly expectational to force you to wall charge it.

    Yes the Solo would be a fun vehicle to own and drive but problematic if you run it out of battery. I really do wish we were seeing more like Stella Lux entering mass production so evolving adding safety features.

  13. dougman says:

    “Do consider carefully why wood-gas vehicles mostly disappeared at the end of world war II. There is a little issue with gasifier burning a hole somewhere and letting air into the gas chamber and blowing to kingdom come.”

    LOL…your impropriety never fails to amaze me Ham-Dong. How the hell is gas going to burn a hole in the gasifier, when said gasifier is lined. You have no eff’n clue as to what you are talking about.

    “Same reason why you should never brew up biodiesel against your houses wall or equally stupid location because if the process goes wrong it also explodes.”

    LOL….biodiesel does not explode you idiot, just like diesel does not explode. Hell, you cannot even light light diesel with a match. Totally off-topic, but with your ADD and dyslexia, I know you like to babble.

    “Yes running your care on moonshine also has the same kind of problems with legal issues.”

    As if you know ANYTHING about such a topic. If someone uses moonshine on one’s conveyance, then please explain how wood gas is illegal as well, hell, off-road diesel, according to you is illegal using your faulty logic.

  14. DrLoser wrote, “There’s a possible issue with parts and repairs and such, but obviously you would take that into account.”

    One huge advantage of electric cars is that there are fewer moving parts. Three wheels instead of four saves money on tires and wheel-bearings. Electric motors just have two bearings on the shaft and zero other wearing parts. The fact that a motor can spin at low or high RPM very efficiently means there is no need for a variable speed transmission. Again fewer parts to wear/maintain. So, I expect tires and wheel-bearings to be the chief maintenance. The biggest cost will be insurance. The capital cost per annum over a 10-20 year life should be tiny. I am not so confident about the battery but they guarantee it for five years so it may well be good for ten. Perhaps there will be a decrease in range over the life of the battery. I don’t know much about lithium batteries except that I’ve seen a bunch bursting into flames or needing replacement after two or three years in mobiles…

    Ah! Come on. I’m allowed to drive a little red convertible as an old guy. Why not an electric car?

  15. DrLoser says:

    Have you considered the Alvin Straight solution, Robert? I’m pretty sure you could get an electric lawnmower these days that would fit the bill. Oh, and it doubles up (obviously) as a lawnmower!

    All joking aside, I think this idea of yours is worth exploring. There’s a possible issue with parts and repairs and such, but obviously you would take that into account.

    Quite frankly you’d have more than enough mobility for your everyday needs, you’d have friends, hunting companions, and relatives from whom to borrow a flat-bed when the need arises, and you could always drive into town in your one-seater and splurge on a one or two day car/truck rental on the odd occasion.

    You’re actually making sense here.

  16. oiaohm says:

    I am seriously looking at get a junker, registering it as farm vehicle, as my land is titled agriculture and burning wood-gas as fuel.
    Do consider carefully why wood-gas vehicles mostly disappeared at the end of world war II. There is a little issue with gasifier burning a hole somewhere and letting air into the gas chamber and blowing to kingdom come.

    Same reason why you should never brew up biodiesel against your houses wall or equally stupid location because if the process goes wrong it also explodes.

    Yes running your care on moonshine also has the same kind of problems with legal issues.

    One thing fuel production has in common is fairly much all explosives when the production process goes the wrong way.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long-distance_running
    “In my younger day I would run 10-15 miles”
    Dougman that is 24Km. At school each year we had a run of 25Km with a 3 hour finish what basically bus picking up those who had not got to the school yet. World record speed is about a 1h and a 30 mins. Top athletes can normally do it in 2 hours on a cool day.

    http://www.weightloss.com.au/exercise/fun-runs/fun-runs-melbourne.html
    To be scary around Australia we have 100km so called fun runs you are meant to complete those in 8-12 hours. Start time to Sun set is your max time. Basically if you cannot complete 25km in under 2 hours there are quite a few runs in Australia you should not enter because you are too slow to reach 100KM inside the 8 hours of daylight you have from start time to sunset so will finish the race disqualified.

    5 miles is a 30min to 45min run to a highly fit person not running at world record speed.

    Still a person running 1hour and 30 min to 2 hours and 15 min every day would be a rarity. 3 hours 15 miles is a person who is not in fact completely fit so a little over/under weight or under muscle toned and a person who cannot complete it in that time does need to look at their fitness. Mind you is nothing uncommon for people not be in best physical form for them. Yes the 3 hour time limit 25km is basically are you fit test.

    I also find it funny how many USA people tell me that 25KM that is a little more than 15 miles should take 3 hours or more. Mostly because USA people have not worked out why it take average USA person that is they are in fact unfit.

  17. dougman wrote, “I find that HIGHLY unlikely,as that is three hours of running at least.”

    Chuckle. I was a runner, not a jogger. I was once listed in the top ten distance runners in Manitoba because of a race where the best runners did not show… I could run a mile in 5 minutes, two miles in 11 minutes and ten miles in an hour. I tried a marathon once but ran way too fast to finish. Still I made it to 22 miles. I used to run 18 miles on Sundays but I never ran further than that so I needed to reduce speed a bit for a marathon. It was all about energy storage. I had the aerobic capacity/throughput. I had to quit running seriously after 1975 because of a spinal injury incurred in my youth and aggravated by running.

  18. dougman says:

    EH.

    Again you are looking to spend money needlessly. I am seriously looking at get a junker, registering it as farm vehicle, as my land is titled agriculture and burning wood-gas as fuel.

    http://www.motherearthnews.com/green-transportation/green-vehicles/wood-gas-zm0z12amzroc

    Tied in with fast growing tulip popular or willow trees, I have a renewable and green fuel to use, over my lifetime.

  19. dougman says:

    “In my younger day I would run 10-15 miles”

    I find that HIGHLY unlikely,as that is three hours of running at least.

    One of my coworkers ran 5-miles a day every morning no matter the weather. He was ex. Navy and sometimes swam in the evening upon getting home from work. The man was 50= years old and in better shape then the majority of 20-year olds.

  20. dougman wrote, “Spending money on an electric doodad, charged from non-existent solar doodads is not a feasible solution.”

    Look. I’ve described why such a vehicle matches my use pattern very closely. A bicycle does not. I just don’t have the horse-power anymore. In my younger day I would run 10-15 miles every noon-hour or to go to work, but these days I walk on level ground rather slowly so a bike would be quite limiting. e.g. I don’t want to be sweated-up when I visit my doctor. A bike might be feasible for the shorter trips but I have a bike and haven’t used it in years. The kids pump up the tires and take it for a spin from time to time. A bike certainly would be pressed to carry parcels and such. I remember one time I did take a bike to the P.O. With a parcel balanced on the handle-bars and steering with one hand, I lost control in some soft sand and ended up in a heap on the road. I was a lot younger then. These days I know I would not bounce.

    The tricycle car is very interesting. It’s a bit expensive but when my annuity rises next year, I could just make monthly payments on it. The insurance would likely be a real sticker-shocker because I bet these fragile things would be easy to write off. Solar panels are very practical these days. I could easily generate a few KW and run power through an inverter to charge the car. Typically they recharge in 8h or so, no problem at all. Of course long trips would be quite awkward. e.g. To drive it back from Vancouver to Winnipeg might take weeks… Fortunately they will have a dealership in Winnipeg soon.

    The last traffic accident I had was … never, so a vehicle like this would probably last all my driving days. The battery is guaranteed for 5years but will likely last 8 or 10. Unfortunately, it’s lithium so I will check that out before sitting on top of a bomb… Our Lexus uses NimH which is very safe, reliable and durable but it’s somewhat less dense in energy storage.

    It’s somewhat similar to driving a motor-bike but I expect the motor-bike is much more lethal. Yes, I think an old gentleman should have an electric car. The real question is colour. They have only one interesting colour, red.

  21. dougman says:

    Here’s an thought, you should get a recumbent bike with a cab on it. It will give you exercise, while saving you money on fuel.

    Spending money on an electric doodad, charged from non-existent solar doodads is not a feasible solution.

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