Meanwhile, In An Alternate Universe, M$ Defines Reality

“Changing the motherboard, however, generates a new installation ID. Under Microsoft’s sometimes Byzantine licensing rules, your license is valid if you replace a motherboard because of hardware failure. You need a new license if you chose to upgrade the motherboard, because you’re essentially building a new PC.”
 
See Microsoft tweaks activation rules for the Windows 10 Anniversary Update
Chuckle. The slaves of M$ accept that upgrading a motherboard is “essentially building a new PC”. No, it isn’t. A motherboard is just one of several components that a user can clean, replace or even repair to get the use of a computer that a person wants. It’s only in M$’s alternate universe that the “new PC” concept exists. You do not build a new house when you change the flooring. You do not build a new car when you change the engine or the tires. I certainly do not make a new flower-pot when I plant a seed in it.

My Beast is on its fourth motherboard, second case, 8 or ninth hard drive, third PSU, and I’ve run several different NICs in it. It’s still “Beast”. I think of it as “Beast III” for the generations of 32-bit, to 64-bit to quad-core CPUs but I ran essentially the same source code on all three generations.

No. This is an essential part of Freedom when considering Free/Libre Open Source Software. You get to use the hardware you own to its full potential because you can run, examine, modify and distribute the software on any or as many PCs or servers as you like. Amen. I recommend Debian GNU/Linux because it sets me and my hardware FREE.

About Robert Pogson

I am a retired teacher in Canada. I taught in the subject areas where I have worked for almost forty years: maths, physics, chemistry and computers. I love hunting, fishing, picking berries and mushrooms, too.
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39 Responses to Meanwhile, In An Alternate Universe, M$ Defines Reality

  1. oiaohm says:

    “I forgot to mention I actually like Windows activation, because before activation became a thing, local PC builders just had one Windows install disc and used it to install Windows on all the PCs they built. Which meant you didn’t get an install disc when buying a new PC and couldn’t do simple things like reinstalling the OS.”
    Before activation thing you were meant to get a book with a certificate on it when got a machine with Windows on it. Here in Australia not providing it would end up with local PC Builder having to refund the full price of the all computers sold to everyone who bough computers from them. Result was PC builder bankrupt most of the time. Yes Fairtrading not copyright enforcement. Fair trading laws in Australia forbid selling fake products and a fake product have it complete price refunded no matter how much it cost the maker of it worse is proof of selling 1 fake product is refund everything that could be a fake product. So Australia has had very limited cases of people selling machines without proper licensing.

    My first Windows CD was window 95. Windows install media started disappearing with Windows XP when Microsoft let more companies custom roll windows.

    Please remember Oracle, IBM, …. many others have different forms of product activation to prevent same kind of wilful piracy. Active instance licensing you still have to activate the product. Microsoft does provide a form of Active Instance license in the form of “Key Management Service”. So big companies using volume licenses can change their motherboards as much as the like without spending any extra money answer is no. Volume license versions of Windows are only upgrades. So any new license restriction on Windows effects volume license users as well. This is where windows licensing becomes a layered mess.

    Even running Windows in a virtual machine on Linux brings it own problems.

    http://www.tenforums.com/general-support/36268-there-retail-version-windows-10-available-purchase.html
    Before Windows 10 you could go out and buy a retail version of windows that legally use to allow you to change motherboards as many times as you liked as long as you had only 1 active instance. Or in the case of Australia buy the OEM disc and install it yourself so making you the system builder so legally allowed to change the motherboard as much as you like.

    Microsoft is stopping selling per active instance version of Windows. From the first version of MS Dos to end of Windows 8.1 customers have always had the option of paying more for a retail copy that was active instance licensed. Interesting enough most pirated version of windows were not using retail/active instance product keys.

    After all the free copies of Windows 10 Microsoft has given away this is an attempt to improve their bottom line.

  2. kurkosdr says:

    lf my previous post, = of my previous post,

  3. kurkosdr says:

    Yes, Windows had lots of security problems in those pre – UAC, pre-NT6.0 days, we get it.

    How is this relevant to today’s Windows experience?

    How is this relevant to the fact activation policies got install discs and legally – licensed software to average users that are buying PCs from local PC builders? Because that was the main point lf my previous post, for those with reading comprehension skills so low that they need everything explained to them in toddler terms.

  4. kurkosdr wrote, “I forgot to mention I actually like Windows activation, because before activation became a thing, local PC builders just had one Windows install disc and used it to install Windows on all the PCs they built. Which meant you didn’t get an install disc when buying a new PC and couldn’t do simple things like reinstalling the OS.”

    Yes, path 19 of M$’s Routes To Slavery. Reinstalling TOOS is rarely easy IMHO. I remember a case where the school’s secretary had a PC-meltdown. TOOS would not run and there was no time to install/”fix” things. I was tasked with getting her PC to run ASAP. I immediately installed GNU/Linux and she was able to do all her regular tasks with no problem. A few days later, I was asked to reinstall TOOS. That was done but the machine had no internet connectivity. It seems the driver on the CD had versions a, and b of NIC-driver X but not version c, the version of the chip on our NIC… So, without network connectivity, there was no way for the OS or that PC to retrieve the driver. That was in a school where there was no general LAN (Yes, I am that old…) so I managed to download on another PC and transfer the driver by floppy. So, no, installing or re-installing TOOS is not easy. The NIC was a widely used Realtek 8139 thing that had been around for ages. The real issue was why did the damned OS need to be re-installed? A real OS doesn’t destroy itself regularly to keep people in practice/slavery re-installing it. GNU/Linux certainly doesn’t call for re-installation. Beast, for instance, has only had two installations, the first one with 32-bit GNU/Linux (I was distro-hopping in the early days so it likely wasn’t Debian), then 64-bit Debian GNU/Linux. No reinstallation was required to switch from a single-core Athlon 64 to quad-core or a new motherboard. I just moved the cables from the hard drives to the new motherboard… I’ve dist-upgraded several times with great results.

  5. kurkosdr says:

    BTW, I forgot to mention I actually like Windows activation, because before activation became a thing, local PC builders just had one Windows install disc and used it to install Windows on all the PCs they built. Which meant you didn’t get an install disc when buying a new PC and couldn’t do simple things like reinstalling the OS. You had to pay them a fee to do it for you or buy your own Windows install disc. Or find another guy with an install disc and copy it (no broadband back then…)

    I got my first Windows CD with XP, despite never having run warez Windows before…

  6. oiaohm says:

    Can anybody out there explain what you do when you’ve trashed the registry and consequently have no internet connection and cannot authenticate your Windows 10 license?
    Dr Loser funny how you get it wrong. Windows not activated but its still running. A defect reg clean just causes strangeness. System cannot see that its got a internet connected. So it will not attempt to get updates or attempt to activate over network. Direct user to activating over phone. So person rings up activates ok everything appears good until the computer reboots and its now no longer activated.

    Basically I typed “not registering” instead of cannot authenticate for a reason. The Windows 10 would authenticate over and over again just never truly write that activation state down to disc so next reboot state gone again.

    This is basically windows gone nuts. Fix reinstall windows remove OEM malware before letting user back at it. Of course there was absolutely nothing wrong with the internet connection just windows badly stuffed up.

    By the way there is a 2012 book with the complete BP final report in it over the 2010 court case oil spill. Yes it so stupid the court case was done before the full forensics so most of the court case was based on people guess what was in use not what was in fact in use and it configuration.

  7. Dr Loser says:

    In fact there is something here. Its not EULA preventing you from changing motherboard out. Its changing motherboard will trigger the computer to no longer be activated then not be able to activate.

    Bollocks, Fifi. A more rigorous cite, if you please.

    And if an oil platform in the middle of the Gulf of Mexico doesn’t have a fault-tolerant computing system — then I would suggest that this problem is rather more important than the question of M$ licensing.

    Apart from anything else, and assuming a decent risk analysis, that would suggest that BP should have bought in a cluster of data acquisition computers. One single failure should never be an issue. Not, at least, within six sigmas.

    But then again, I’m ahead of you on a professional solution, Bull Semen Girl. All you’ve got so far is one self-serving cite full of “maybes.”

    I confidently predict that your Inquirer cite will turn out to be the best one you have.

  8. Dr Loser says:

    Can anybody out there explain what you do when you’ve trashed the registry and consequently have no internet connection and cannot authenticate your Windows 10 license?

    I’m not expecting Fifi to be able to do this, because in my opinion, Fifi is a brain-dead idiot. I’ll retract that if he gives an honest answer that achieves the objective, though.

    I’m pretty sure that somebody out there can think up a solution. It took me rather less than thirty seconds to think it up.

    It’s not complicated. It doesn’t involve the sort of mucking around in the kernel that Fifi apparently thinks can be explained to a deadline of 24 hours.

    In fact, it would be embarrassing if nobody out there can figure it out.

    You don’t have to believe it’s a good solution. You don’t have to believe it’s the right solution. You don’t even have to like the consequences, which would obviously be the authentication of a Windows 10 license.

    All you have to do is to think of it as an intellectual problem.

    You do have those in the FLOSS world, I assume?

  9. oiaohm says:

    Dr Loser the links there are not the final forensic rebuild that happens in 2011 after all the court cases the links on that document are where people are giving statements about what they believed that saw as was required to take case forwards. BP did a full forensic report to work out what in processes has to be changed to prevent equal happening again that the 2011 report.

    Nothing at all to do with how the EULA somehow prevents changing your broken motherboard out.
    In fact there is something here. Its not EULA preventing you from changing motherboard out. Its changing motherboard will trigger the computer to no longer be activated then not be able to activate. Lets hope someone is not remote needing to do a repair on a critical system running Windows and they find they need to change motherboards.

    So this is not a EULA issue but an activation issue and Dr Loser is too big of idiot to see this and I just brought in what the biggest risk is from activation failure. A system failing properly due to not being activated can directly endanger lives.

    Maybe every critical system should be forbin from running windows.

  10. Dr Loser says:

    Michael Williams, the chief electronics technician on the Deepwater Horizon rig survived the explosion that killed 11 and dumped millions of gallons of oil into the Gulf of Mexico by jumping into the ocean. Williams testified that before the explosion he saw a computer that he claims was used for monitoring drilling operations frozen with a BSOD. In the understandable rush to save his own life, Williams could not positively identify the operating system, however Microsoft’s Windows family of operating systems is commonly linked with BSODs.

    Apparently the computer system, which provided the drilling rig with critical information, had been seizing up for weeks. According to Williams, “It would just turn blue. You’d have no data coming through.” Every time this would happen, the crew would be without vital information to monitor the well and drilling operations.

    Quoted from your cite, little girlie.

    I’m going to leave aside the obvious bias involved if you were on that platform. I’m going to leave aside the obvious temptation to find somebody else to blame. I’m even going to leave aside the “he claims,” the “not positively,” and the “Apparently.”

    Although, in passing, little girlie, I strongly suggest that you do not pursue an alternative career as an Expert Witness. You’d be torn apart. Stick to bull semen, that’s your best bet.

    Anyhow, this has no application at all to Windows license activation, does it?

    How’s your rat-like scrabbling around, searching for some feeble defense against my description of that Windows 10 issue you mentioned, going, btw?

  11. Dr Loser says:

    O yes it is Dr loser the idiot. 2011 report on that 2010 oil spill documenting how they end up there.

    Followed by total babble, Princess.

    Nothing at all to do with how the EULA somehow prevents changing your broken motherboard out.

    Do read the original cite in the OP and respond accordingly, little ignorant girlie.

  12. oiaohm says:

    Its like the oil platform using not update Windows XP to run critical safety gear that cause a major oil disaster due to a known Windows software bug.

    No it isn’t, Princess.
    http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1724792/microsoft-deep-water-oil-spill
    O yes it is Dr loser the idiot. 2011 report on that 2010 oil spill documenting how they end up there. The document reasons for disabling updates was WGA and activation issues using satellite internet. Some of the crashes the system was suffering from would have been fixed by the latest XP updates possibly stopping the complete oil spill.

    So this issue was clearly reported to Microsoft in 2011 and it still not fixed. Basically GEO locking activation and WGA causes problems depending on what machine end up on the receiving end could have some nasty environmental effects or could kill someone.

    Activation issues should not be classed as minor.

    What sort of idiot would do that, and expect to get away with it? (It’s not even as though you don’t get the option to back up the registry, if you feel like it.)
    People do forget to do backups a lot.

    Is this all you ever think about? Really, seriously, weird ways to construct some flimsy edge case, which requires monumentally stupid behavior on the part of the customer?
    To be correct it was not monumentally stupidity on part of customer. The incompatible registry clearer bundled with the computer from the OEM that made it. Of course absolutely nothing was wrong with the internet connection in that case but the person was blaming it over and over again on the internet connection. I was not blaming the user as incompetent because they should be able to expect OEM to only bundle compatible software. Microsoft starting to experiment with how to offer end users clean installs would help to reduce some of these OEM installed malware nightmare cases. Really malware blocking activation and WGA does happen as well. So there are just multi levels of pain.

  13. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “I wasn’t bothered, I just made the mistake of trying to help… Sorry!”

    No problem, everyone makes mistakes.

  14. Dr Loser says:

    I am a bear of very slow thinking. And it does not help that oiaohm chooses to expatiate in Prusso-Anglian misspelt babble.

    So then, having slowly thought this through, in the manner of a low-latency pseudo hard RT Linux kernel twiddle, let me see if I have this scenario right.

    1) Customer buys a PC with Windows 10 on it. I’m pretty sure I have this right so far. It seems to be a Fifi stipulation.
    2) Customer doesn’t have an Internet connection, and chooses to authenticate Windows 10 later. I’m pretty sure I have this right, too, because Fifi stipulates the lack of an Internet connection.
    3) Customer runs an “incompatible” Registry Clean on this brand-new, unauthenticated machine. Yeah, right. That is soooooooooooooo likely
    4) Customer loses the right to authenticate Windows 10 under the Microsoft EULA. Again, this seems to be a Fifi stipulation.

    Doesn’t any part of that strike you lot as, well, odd?

    Doesn’t it occur to any of you lot that the customer has an instant recourse?

    Here’s an exercise in common sense for you all. Let’s assume you are the gibbering idiot that Fifi thinks you are. Let’s assume you do all of that.

    How would you go about getting back to a position whereat you can legitimately authenticate your M$ Windows 10 license?

    Fifi would give you twenty four hours, but I am not so generous.

    If you can’t come up with the obvious answer inside thirty seconds, you’re an ignorant booby.

  15. Dr Loser says:

    Its like the oil platform using not update Windows XP to run critical safety gear that cause a major oil disaster due to a known Windows software bug.

    No it isn’t, Princess.

  16. Dr Loser says:

    And those hundreds of millions of sheeple believe that Windows XP is a different OS from Windows 7 is a different OS from Windows 8 is a different OS from Windows 10.

    You know what, Robert? It’s just occurred to me. You don’t even believe that NT is a different OS from Win9x, do you?

    The hundreds of millions of sheeple might not be very well informed when they make this distinction between Windows XP, Windows 7, Windows 8 and Windows 10.

    But they still have a far better understanding of operating systems than you do.

    Wisdom of the Sheeple, Robert, Wisdom of the Sheeple … O abnormal one.

  17. Dr Loser says:

    That reminds me Windows 10 not registering. Cause could not see it was connected to internet cause some use run incompatible registry clean program.

    What sort of idiot would do that, and expect to get away with it? (It’s not even as though you don’t get the option to back up the registry, if you feel like it.)

    Do you understand what “incompatible” means, Fifi?

    Is this all you ever think about? Really, seriously, weird ways to construct some flimsy edge case, which requires monumentally stupid behavior on the part of the customer?

    There’s a small core of lunatics like you out in what passes for the real world who do that, Fifi.

    There are hundreds of millions of people who do not do so. They are not affected by your edge cases. They do not give a shit.

    And, since nothing even approaching the Armageddon of your dreams happens to them, they have no reason to give a shit.

    Numbers, dear girl. Numbers.

  18. Dr Loser says:

    My software is licensed without reference to any CPU/motherboard/day of the month/etc.

    Once again, Robert, what you do, and believe, is completely irrelevant to the argument. It’s what the hundreds of millions of “sheeple” out there do, and believe, that counts.

    Those hundreds of millions of sheeple believe that, for all intents and purposes, a motherboard is a PC. Not that it matters, because the vast majority of them just buy a new PC.

    And those hundreds of millions of sheeple believe that Windows XP is a different OS from Windows 7 is a different OS from Windows 8 is a different OS from Windows 10.

    Now, they may be wrong. But they, unlike you, understand that there is a commercial line to be drawn. And they, unlike you, recognize that, under the Microsoft EULA, the company from whom they acquire that license is drawing a mutually acceptable line.

    The sheeple are normal and very, very numerous, Robert.

    You are solitary and completely abnormal.

  19. oiaohm says:

    fixed network connection solved the problem.
    That reminds me Windows 10 not registering. Cause could not see it was connected to internet cause some use run incompatible registry clean program.

    Wizard Emeritus not assian using sat internet end up with regular failures to WGA and Activate perfectly legal copy of windows. You might call that a internet connection issue using different downlinks in different countries. So Microsoft activation can become a pain in ass for mines and oil platforms due to heavy usage of sat internet.

    Its like the oil platform using not update Windows XP to run critical safety gear that cause a major oil disaster due to a known Windows software bug. Reason why updating Windows XP was more likely to trigger a WGA or other issue so they had decided against it so resulting in killing a lot of wild life. So there is an environmental cost to Microsoft activation model. Again this was a perfectly legal copy of Windows. Very interesting report to read after that disaster.

    Wizard Emeritus the fact Microsoft products have trouble activating and WGA properly on sat connections has caused some major harm and people work around the issues.

  20. Dr Loser says:

    Mine, of course. For every billion people who subscribe to The Wiz’s world view their are two billion who have a smartphone instead of a Wintel PC.

    Since your original opinion stated very clearly that you know of many, many people who have had problems with M$ license authentication — which has nothing at all to do with this pathetic response, Robert …

    And since, I am sure, you cannot reference a single person who has had M$ licensing problems with their smart-phone — and therefore smart-phones have nothing at all to do with your original opinion, Robert …

    May I politely suggest that, by randomly changing the subject, your opinion, no matter how worthy it might be in every other case, is actually not worth doodle in this instance?

    You’re just blowing smoke out of your arse.

  21. luvr says:

    “And if you are bothered by my conversation with Robert Pogson, you can keep your two cents to yourself and ignore my words.”

    I wasn’t bothered, I just made the mistake of trying to help… Sorry!

  22. Dr Loser says:

    Number 2 is a major issue.

    No it isn’t, Fifi. People don’t do it in significant numbers. Show me the significant numbers and I will provisionally admit that it is a major issue, although I would still need to examine the license.

    You know what people do, these days, when their old PC goes phut?

    They buy another one, complete with a new Microsoft license.

    They don’t even blink.

    We’re not in the De Dion Bouton era of PCs any more, where the original cost was outrageously high, the maintenance was a nightmare even without factoring in Pogson’s incompetence, and the useful life of a PC was maybe 2 years until some new shiny thing came along that demanded an upgrade, even if the old hardware could still limp along.

    Well, I say we are not in the De Dion Bouton era.

    You lot clearly believe you are.

  23. The Wiz wrote, “whose experiences do you think are more representative?”

    Mine, of course. For every billion people who subscribe to The Wiz’s world view their are two billion who have a smartphone instead of a Wintel PC. Even places with some wealth and Internet are preferring to go with FLOSS and/or smartphones to avoid the dreadful expense and inefficiency of the Wintel monopoly. The reason is the same as I found in remote schools. People can buy twice as much IT for the same money by using FLOSS and ARM. Businesses that treat Wintel as the cost of doing business will be less competitive than the new folks who do not use Wintel. Game over soon. Just look at Trump. This buffoon is telling USA they can’t compete against low wages and lower costs of doing business. He’s telling USA to build walls to keep out competition. USA will become a backwater if he gets his way. Europe is using more FLOSS every day. Same for Africa and Asia. USA is holding back IT in the world by clinging to Wintel. The world isn’t going to follow USA’s lead any longer. Bye-bye.

  24. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Businesses, OTOH, are spending huge amounts for IT that they don’t need to by using non-Free software. ”

    And as someone who actually worked in IT, I can state that that is an ignorant statement, but someone who has demonstrated in his words and anecdotes zero understanding of IT that a business world uses.

  25. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “If you are bothered by his “whining”, then you can choose to no longer come here and be left in peace all you want.”

    And if you are bothered by my conversation with Robert Pogson, you can keep your two cents to yourself and ignore my words.

    They are not directed to you at any rate.

  26. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Oh no. I’ve seen so many people who could not get TOOS to authenticate.”

    And the only people that I’ve seen who had problems either got sole an improperly licensed copy by their local asian PC shop, or who had a defective connection to the internet. In the first case, fortunately, the local guy “fixed” the problem when confronted. IN the latter, a fixed network connection solved the problem.

    Most of your experiences were in isolated locations. My experiences are not.

    whose experiences do you think are more representative?

  27. oiaohm says:

    Mind you this recent change in Microsoft licensing is going to get expensive.

    Changing the motherboard, however, generates a new installation ID. Under Microsoft’s sometimes Byzantine licensing rules, your license is valid if you replace a motherboard because of hardware failure. You need a new license if you chose to upgrade the motherboard, because you’re essentially building a new PC.

    How this is a problem.
    http://www8.hp.com/au/en/support-drivers/total-care/extended-warranty.html
    1) computer warranties are 3 and the motherboard in the computer might no longer be made after the last computer leaves the production line so a newer model has to be used even if all other parts remain the same. Just replacing a motherboard is not building a new PC.
    2) Define upgrade the motherboard does this class motherboards of same model numbers but with different revision numbers might be regarded by Microsoft upgrading motherboard. Why these do show a different motherboard ID value.

    Number 2 is a major issue. Remember back to the busted caps mess that happened on a lot of motherboards as the board with proper caps were produces they all got a new revision number to make software tracking down defective boards simpler. Now if we lose these unique software checkable values to make Windows happy its going to make finding hardware with known faults in large businesses massively harder.

    I am more happy with FOSS licenses or Redhat/Orcale type that are active instance licenses. You don’t have either back you into conner due to a hardware failure and it not discouraging hardware vendors not to show hardware revision numbers in firmware information.

    So your definition of “a new PC” — you explicitly state that this is the third incarnation of the Beast, which means that you see it as “new” in some way — is tied to the version of the CPU rather than the version of the motherboard?
    Dr Loser hit the nail on head than missed it. The true issue is linking to version of motherboard or cpu id number. Why repairing a computer from hardware failures at times equals replacing those parts.

    The problem is the actions to build a new PC and repair a old PC overlap. Even a 2 year old computer broken under warranty might require a more powerful motherboard installed because the motherboard type it had is no longer in production. Active instance licensing is sane in all cases of hardware failure of course its not as profitable.

  28. The Wiz wrote, “The vast majority of those who license software commercially get along quite nicely.”

    Oh no. I’ve seen so many people who could not get TOOS to authenticate. Several times I’ve seen the same software provider give schools grief. Even M$ threatened schools with audits to encourage excessive licensing. Several incidents of non-Free software biting schools for $thousands for little/no benefit have convinced me that non-Free software has no place in schools if it has place anywhere. Schools produce a product, generations of educated young people, and there is absolutely no requirement that they use non-Free software to do that. It’s a match made in Heaven. Schools were locked into paper until very recently so they don’t have the severe multi-generational lock-in of some businesses but even the most locked-in can see the light and migrate to FLOSS. IT is highly desirable for education but there exist many schools without a proper network or even a proper distribution of electrical power. I’ve seen classrooms with two (yes, 2) electrical outlets. They were designed and built with an assumption that PCs were too expensive ever to be widely used in schools. One or two PCs per classroom doesn’t cut it. With FLOSS one can simply inject more PCs into a school leaving more money where it is needed, hardware and networking infrastructure. Businesses, OTOH, are spending huge amounts for IT that they don’t need to by using non-Free software. The world needs software but it doesn’t need M$ nor Intel for that matter. Businesses that work for a living are desirable. Monopoly is not even in serving other businesses.

  29. luvr wrote, “I’m not inclined to believe that he will pursue you in any way.”

    I’m not inclined to travel at all these days. Did too much travelling in my working life. I don’t even search the web for the Wiz’s other writings. He may even have a blog somewhere of which I know nothing.

  30. luvr says:

    “Someday perhaps, you will come to respect that other choice and leave us in peace.”

    But… In what way do you believe that he does not leave you in peace? If you are bothered by his “whining”, then you can choose to no longer come here and be left in peace all you want. I’m not inclined to believe that he will pursue you in any way.

  31. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “Meanwhile, with TOOS, one needs a database and has a constant threat of an audit or a failure to operate.”

    Bullshit. The vast majority of those who license software commercially get along quite nicely. You on the other hand seem to need to continually justify your use of software for free. Enjoy your gift of zero monetary cost software licenses Robert Pogson. But remember, it is a free world and others may choose to make different choices.

    Someday perhaps, you will come to respect that other choice and leave us in peace.

  32. Wizard Emeritus says:

    “My software is licensed without reference to any CPU/motherboard/day of the month/etc. My software is licensed per copy and the licence is included with the copy. What could be simpler? Meanwhile, with TOOS, one needs a database and has a constant threat of an audit or a failure to operate. I’ll take FLOSS any time.”

    So what. To paraphrase you own words, Nobody put you in charge Robert Pogson. Your opinions are you own, period.

  33. Dr Loser wrote, “there has to be some form of legal definition for licensing to work. All you’re saying is that you don’t like licensing because you don’t like licensing, which is as always with you a circular argument.”

    My software is licensed without reference to any CPU/motherboard/day of the month/etc. My software is licensed per copy and the licence is included with the copy. What could be simpler? Meanwhile, with TOOS, one needs a database and has a constant threat of an audit or a failure to operate. I’ll take FLOSS any time.

    Dr Loser also wrote, “your ridiculous claim that you have been running the same software for the last ten years or so (“essentially”) doesn’t hold up to close scrutiny. You haven’t. In fact, as far as the kernel goes — again, a fair proxy for all the other software you run — you seem to spin up a new one every other month or so.”

    Linux is tens of megabytes of source code. Every couple of weeks the boys and girls at kernel.org update a few kilobytes of code. So, there is code in my present kernel that was in the original one I used. Packages evolve usually. Only rarely are they rewritten from scratch.

    /fs/jfs$ less jfs_inode.c
    “Copyright (C) International Business Machines Corp., 2000-2004”
    Now, I didn’t use JFS back in the day, but I could have. It was in the kernel.

    I was in fact using ext2 at first:
    fs/ext2$ less inode.c
    “* Copyright (C) 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995
    * Remy Card (card@masi.ibp.fr)
    * Laboratoire MASI – Institut Blaise Pascal
    * Universite Pierre et Marie Curie (Paris VI)
    *
    * from
    *
    * linux/fs/minix/inode.c
    *
    * Copyright (C) 1991, 1992 Linus Torvalds
    *
    * Goal-directed block allocation by Stephen Tweedie
    * (sct@dcs.ed.ac.uk), 1993, 1998
    * Big-endian to little-endian byte-swapping/bitmaps by
    * David S. Miller (davem@caip.rutgers.edu), 1995
    * 64-bit file support on 64-bit platforms by Jakub Jelinek
    * (jj@sunsite.ms.mff.cuni.cz)
    *
    * Assorted race fixes, rewrite of ext2_get_block() by Al Viro, 2000
    */”

  34. The Wiz wrote, “who put you in charge,Robert Pogson!”

    GoDaddy, ten years ago.

  35. wizard emeritus says:

    hey who put you in charge,Robert Pogson!

  36. Dr Loser says:

    I think of it as “Beast III” for the generations of 32-bit, to 64-bit to quad-core CPUs but I ran essentially the same source code on all three generations.

    So your definition of “a new PC” — you explicitly state that this is the third incarnation of the Beast, which means that you see it as “new” in some way — is tied to the version of the CPU rather than the version of the motherboard? That’s a little arbitrary, Robert.

    As is the version of the motherboard, of course. But there’s a reason that everything else is described as “a peripheral.” If a PC is anything, it’s the motherboard.

    Whine all you like, but there has to be some form of legal definition for licensing to work. All you’re saying is that you don’t like licensing because you don’t like licensing, which is as always with you a circular argument.

    Oh, and your ridiculous claim that you have been running the same software for the last ten years or so (“essentially”) doesn’t hold up to close scrutiny. You haven’t. In fact, as far as the kernel goes — again, a fair proxy for all the other software you run — you seem to spin up a new one every other month or so.

    In the end, and leaving commercial and legal shenanigans to one side, it’s all about the mindset of the consumer. When a consumer buys a new PC, they “know” they’re buying a new PC. When they buy, or acquire, a new version of Windows, they “know” they’re buying/acquiring a new OS. The question of a new motherboard is no doubt a little more nuanced, but you won’t find many consumers who (a) do this — except in case of hardware failure, which as your cite points out is an exemption — or (b) would think of it, deep in their hearts, as a new PC.

    There are tens, hundreds, of millions of those consumers out there, Robert. These people are what we call “normal.”

    There’s only one of you, Robert. You are what we call “abnormal.”

    I speak in a statistical sense, of course.

  37. kurkosdr wrote, “would you mind to explain to me, the unworthy ignoramus, what constitutes a change of PC?”

    Well you can change a PC by buying a new one or changing its parts. Neither has anything particular to do with copyright unless a copy is included. M$ can claim copyright on their software but not your PC. That’s bogus and no one should buy a PC or a copy of their software under the terms they impose.

  38. kurkosdr says:

    Pog, would you mind to explain to me, the unworthy ignoramus, what constitutes a change of PC?

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